Teaching in Ho Chi Minh, with a CELTA, but no degree

Hey guys I am a white (I guess that matters) native speaker from the US holding a PhD in Philosophy with eight years teaching experience in higher education.  What do you reckon I'd be looking at in terms of English teaching jobs *without* a CELTA, etc. certificate?

Hello Ngocnhi,

Could you please post an advert in the jobs in Ho Chi Mingh City section? Thank you.

Hi:

I have a Ph.D. in clinical psychology with over 30 years of teaching experience in universities.  I will be coming to PP in late January, 2013.  I have explored and researched teaching English for over a year.  I have discovered that you can get a teaching position without CELTA or TEFL certificate.  However, I decided to take a 4-week training course in PP for 2 reasons:  I know that I will get a better position and I will feel much more prepared to do the job.  Is it worth the $$$... ???  For me it is.

Dan

Hi Oli. About English teaching job, that is POSSIBLE.  Try posting your resume onto vietnamworks.com .You avoid mentioning about the degree if not asked.

Olin wrote:

Hello, I'm Oli 32, from London.

I have recently passed my CELTA, and I really want to teach in Ho Chi Minh, for about a year.

I love Vietnamese culture and the food!

My one problem is that I don't have a degree...yet!

Is it possible to find work without a degree, where should I look? Help me please!

Thanks Oli !

Just to resurrect this tread - and potentially give some insight to those looking to come here without a degree:

I've been living in HCMC for 8 years, and was just let go from VAS for not having a degree/work permit (after about 6 years of employment).  I have met others who have been let go for the same reason (at VAS and elsewhere).  While there is still work to be had at some of the less reputable schools, it is worth nothing that things have changed here recently (with work permit crackdowns and otherwise).  Vietnam is no longer an undiscovered gem, and as such there have been more and more teachers coming here for work - many of whom possess a degree.  Believe me - having been here 8 years - it's been very noticeable. 

I don't want to discourage anyone from coming, but just know that you may be potentially working for more than one lower end school here (without a degree) in order to save any kind of cash.  Myself and others have noticed that the post Chinese New Year slowdown has been particularly bad this year.  I've applied for around 20+ schools, and have only managed to have a few interviews (only to be rejected for those legally qualified - aka in possession of a degree).  Though I don't have a degree, I do have several years of experience, as well as a TESOL certificate.  My lack of luck has been partially due to the time of the year (post CNY is never a great time) but (again) it's been particularly slow. 

Fortunately, I'm within a year of completing my degree, though in the meantime I will be seeking work elsewhere.

Just so you guys know, the work permit regulations include:

A degree AND a TESOL certificate (doesn't have to be a CELTA).

Hello, are you doing your degree in HCMC or online?

Online

If the G really want to tighten the noose, they should go all the way to be more creative. What is the big deal of a 'degree'. Many degrees can be BOUGHT these days by cash, so back to square one ?? Brings us back to dubious educational organizations around the world-aka degree mills!

Hi guys been living in Ho Chi Minh for 7 months now and have a Tefl. I'm just looking for some work does anybody know any schools that are hiring ? Thanks for your help.

Hi Brian88,

I suggest you to post an advert in the Jobs in Ho Chi Minh City section , this might help.

Thank you,

David.

jollypham wrote:

HI Olin!
You don't need to worry about this. There will always be schools offering ESL jobs in Vietnam without qualifications if you do a Demo Class and come off looking like a real teacher.

Salaries vary from $10USD an hour all the way up to $20 USD an hour.
It all depends on your experience, documentation and appearance. If you are well dressed and mannered; have a university degree in any field along with a T.E.F.L. or C.E.L.T.A certificate, you should push hard for the 20 USD an hour.
The hard part comes in getting enough hours. Every school starts you off with very few (Perhaps 10 hours / week). You'll need 30 hours a week if you want to save any real money.

But if you prove yourself quickly, (Students like you and you aren't drunk for class) you'll be at 30 hours a week in no time.

August or September may be the best months for finding jobs teaching English in Vietnam. (Students head back after a summer break) GOOD LUCK !
P/S: I'm Vietnamese and I'm teaching English at foreign language centers in HO CHI MINH CITY. If you have any problems, free to ask me . Hope this can help you.

Wow, and your English, on here at least, is fantastic, unlike many Thai English teachers I know.  Cannot wait to get out of Thailand to be honest. It is so false here.

You don't need teach English in Language Center. Just find someone who wanna learn English at home and teach them . If you want, go to some English Center and ask them for teaching, I think they don't need you to show degree . Good luck

Hi There, just wanted to pass along my experience regarding CELTA courses & teaching. I am a certificated English (and a few other things) teacher in the US, also have an MA. When I was 58, I left my regular teaching job to go to Switzerland with my husband who had just accepted work there. I had always thought I would enjoy teaching English as a second language, and Switzerland is really one of those language learning centers, hosting many language schools.

For a number of reasons, I enrolled in a 4-week CELTA crash course-the one that is offered in Palma, Mallorca. CELTA now has centers all over the world, as I'm sure you know. The cost is relatively high for the CELTA students. Then it was about $3000usd plus lodging & expenses. The group of CELTA students I was in, began with 8 individuals, mostly in their mid-twenties, and most with no university degrees. This CELTA program ran about 7 or 8 groups of CELTA students per year, and had the same two instructors for each group.

The CELTA students in my group were all from the UK, with the exception of me, from the US. One girl quit within the first 3 days. Down to 7. Another guy attempted to quit in the third week, but was cajoled back. This is to say that this particular CELTA program was one of the most unpleasant and for the most part useless things I have ever done.

I have to keep repeating that there are many programs all around the world, and perhaps I just stumbled upon the worst one. However, another unpleasant factoid that no one ever mentions is that even though the CELTA certification is very expensive to get, the teachers who are then employed in the very same language schools that teach CELTA, are paid a pittance. In Palma, the teachers had no materials to work with (ok, not that uncommon in the US either...), but really it was ridiculous. You must have visual aids especially with beginning language learners!

Because CELTA is a Cambridge program, some people apparently believe that it must be the most difficult and therefore most prestigious certificate ever to be awarded. On one particular, but not unusual occasion, one of the young women in my group was 'critiqued' by one of our two instructors during one of her practice lessons. The CELTA instructor sat in the back of the classroom grimacing, and filling two legal-sized pages with notes about what the young teacher was 'doing WRONG.' After the lesson,in front of the other CELTA students the CELTA instructor proceeded to point out with great enthusiasm all of these disastrous (NOT) flaws, humiliating her until she cried. Lovely way to model the treatment of students, I thought. I could go on, and on, even more than I have! But, at least, as my husband would say, 'I've gotten over it...' HA! 

Although in four weeks' time, you can get a brief introduction to language methodology, I don't think it prepares you very much at all for actually being a classroom. One thing you could do for free, is to contact a local school in your area and ask them to observe in different ages and classrooms. If you're in a city, they probably have some ESL programs you might even be able to volunteer in. Whatever the case, your real learning comes from being there in the classroom. Or, in the case of many language schools, being with the individual.

Right now, I'm in Chengdu, China (am about to move to HCMC) and there are TONS of teaching opportunities here for native English speakers. Young, 'old,' whatever! A high salary here is $1600/mo. I think Vietnam tends to be lower, but all these other people in the forum who are there would know much better.

All this is to say, unless you've talked with people who have personal experience with the CELTA program you're looking at, I might take a pass if I were you. A PhD should be enough of a degree to enable you to teach many places. As mentioned before, many language schools have the 'one-on-one' approach, in which case you tailor the instruction to the individual using instructional materials that the school usually recommends.

Since 2008 and CELTA experience, my work has consisted of private tutoring. Worked well in Switzerland, where people are actually paid a decent wage. In Vietnam, maybe not so much. Depends on how much you need to earn.

Wherever your path takes you, good luck! I just wanted to paint a little realism on the CELTA prism. Life is either a grand adventure or nothing at all-or something like that! Cheers, J

[ Moderated : Offensive post ]

Do these teaching jobs include health insurance in the package?

thanlan7465 wrote:

Do these teaching jobs include health insurance in the package?

No

At the better schools you will, but language centres,no.

Now THIS thread is what I call a knowledgeable and informative expat reading!!  I think I read somewhere that the ILA school and another were in HCMC were very reputable here in Vietnam. I was wondering which piece of paper was the best for let's say a 'universal' certification??  I have a Uni. degree and have been teaching for over 5-6 years of all ages.  I want to know if the Celta or tefl if taken will allow me to teach in let's say japan or thailand or any other country..

Please educate me.. for this is a new venture and considering this as a lifelong investment.

Thank You in advance!

Beyondthesee wrote:

...I have a Uni. degree and have been teaching for over 5-6 years of all ages.  I want to know if the Celta or tefl if taken will allow me to teach in let's say japan or thailand or any other country...

Japan- You (generally) need a 4 year degree in anything to get a work permit (without which you will not be able to stay in Japan for more than 6 months out of every 12 unless you marry a Japanese or get a student visa which requires full-time study at a government approved school). Beyond that there are no government prescribed qualifications necessary to teach English - it's up to the schools. Because you have significant experience a Tesol/Celta type of certificate may not be necessary.

You might want to decide on a country, then particular city, then schools and contact them to find out what they would value most. Cheers.

  All that and then some!  Thanks a bundle Nam! Really appreciate the feedback.. wow, that is just fantastic news.. Nothing set.. just was curious as to how much more education I needed or for that matter anyone needed to work with/without a celta/tefl in various countries with my skillset.  I'm ecstatic!

Thank You So Much,

Cheers!

So you make it sound like it is okay as long as i have my CELTA certification, but can I really just arrive in Saigon and rely on finding a teaching job within a week or two? I will probably not have unlimited funds and will seek a job as soon as possible, so assuming I am well presented with a decent resume, should I be worried?

That depends on you. Nobody can say for sure you will get a job. I know a guy who came here from Thailand, he told me he was such a good experienced teacher, it turned out that he was a terrible teacher. If you are a capable teacher you will find a job.

I am very personable and social, and teaching will not be a problem. I also believe that I have enough of a go-getter attitude that I will improve my chances of quick employement, I guess I am just trying to get a sense of the job market before touching down in Vietnam. Thank you for your reply!

If you have good classroom presence and know how to teachyou wont have any problems. Do a walk around of schools and you should get a job without any problems.