Why do we live?

I thought it was so we can watch cartoons.
Now I know it's about food and sex, my life is about to get wild ..... well until I get fat and contract AIDS.

Cheers, dude.

That's no humane perspective. Seems that you are stuck in your lower brain category. It is really a consumerist vicious cycle. You ought to reflect more upon yourself and try to realize what makes you different from other mammals.


Wish you the best.

Isn't that the wrong type of question to ask in a country such as Saudi?

No it is not unless you convine yourself that it is wrong.
Our demeanor towards subjects is ours and none can control, but if you believe that mental shackles could be imposed upon you then you might feel that it is a wrong question.

It's not that. Rather I don't believe there is the freedom to discuss subjects which might question religions answer to the question ("why do we live?" to worship the creator), without facing unwanted accusations, and potentially severe consequences.

You are right about that.

I live to worship my Creator Allaah subhana..... all that pseudo science can miss me... people and their rhetoric  trying to sound all important. kumbayaaaaa

That's great brother. As long as you are happy with your perspective and you realize that it is great for humanity in general then that is really wonderful. I do also believe in Allah like you.
The point is that we should be ready to allow everyone to share his/her perspective without forcing our perspective on matters.

With love and empathy and understanding we can share great ideas and connect wonderfully.
The Quran said "وجعلناكم شعوبا وقبائل لتعارفوا "
so connecting with other people and exchanging experiences is the basis of wonderful civilizations.
As long as you deem some sciences to be wrong, that's also your perspective and you should use valid tools to counter the arguments put forward by what you called pseudo science. We are all here in this world to learn and explore and we are called to think and introspect.

Allah Yibarik feek Akhoy.

I believe in YOLO

hamudi wrote:

I believe in YOLO

I'm sticking to Allah ....................................... and chocolate biscuits.
One is worthy of worship, the other to be enjoyed.

How about that for higher thinking?

Wow you nailed it Fredo!!

Brilliant!

rareshine wrote:

I live to worship my Creator Allaah subhana...

I live to make people smile.

If you want to please the Almighty, I suggest a lot of being nice to as many people as you can.
All that praying is fine, but zero use unless you back it up with actions.
Loads of suffering in the world, try to do a little bit to help people - I'm no expert when it comes to Al Qur'an, but I don't see you getting struck down with a bolt from above for being a good dude.

People get so wrapped up in the worship, they miss the bits about Zakat,

Imagine three dead dudes facing Allah.
The first dead dude tells of his life, praying 5 times a day and spending all his time in the mosque.
The second dead dude tells Allah he prays, but backs it up by trying to be a good person, doing charity work and generally being nice to people.
The third tells Allah he prays 5 times a day, then died by destroying Allah's gift of life to other humans  and creating misery in the name of Allah.

As a fallible human, I could be in error here, but I'm guessing one could scrape in, one will get an easy ride, and one will be told to get stuffed.

we know that religious debate is a NO NO Here .... its a rule of the forum... but this is not a debate. here go the facts.

islam is built on five
. The testimony that there is no god worthy of except Allah and that Muhammad (sallallaahu alaihi wa-sallam) is His slave and Messenger,
2. To establish prayer,
3. To give Zakaat (obligatory charity),
4. To fast in Ramadhan, and,
5. To perform Hajj (pilgrimage).” [Saheeh Muslim and Saheeh al-Bukharee]

so yeah its nice to be nice... but there is no PILLAR in my deen that makes it obligatory for me to make people smile, and there is a pillar for me to perform my prayers. so your claim that it means zero is FALSE>
of course you can't harm someone  or take someones life or take their property or or... but my mission in life is not to make people smile.

Fred wrote:

rareshine wrote:

I live to worship my Creator Allaah subhana...

I live to make people smile.

If you want to please the Almighty, I suggest a lot of being nice to as many people as you can.
All that praying is fine, but zero use unless you back it up with actions.
Loads of suffering in the world, try to do a little bit to help people - I'm no expert when it comes to Al Qur'an, but I don't see you getting struck down with a bolt from above for being a good dude.

People get so wrapped up in the worship, they miss the bits about Zakat,

Imagine three dead dudes facing Allah.
The first dead dude tells of his life, praying 5 times a day and spending all his time in the mosque.
The second dead dude tells Allah he prays, but backs it up by trying to be a good person, doing charity work and generally being nice to people.
The third tells Allah he prays 5 times a day, then died by destroying Allah's gift of life to other humans  and creating misery in the name of Allah.

As a fallible human, I could be in error here, but I'm guessing one could scrape in, one will get an easy ride, and one will be told to get stuffed.

To give Zakaat (obligatory charity),

Is making a sad person happy a form of charity?
Narrow interpretations are fine for lawyers.

PS  - Charity because you have to is like paying tax. You don't like it, but you do it because someone will slap you if you don't.
You should do it because you know it's right.

Sociologists say that even the most introverted person will interact and influence 10,000 other people in his/her average lifetime. In my view, here is where you have a catch apart from the religious perspective -- your interactions and influence.

If we view with this standpoint, making people smile, charity -- all comes under positively influencing thousands of people you interact with during your life. How far you'll go in this pursuit is what I think is why we live. Like faces are different, everyone is born with some unique objective. Some faces are similar; but so are the objectives of lives for some.

obligatory charity = ZAKAAT is clear that it is 2.5% of your surplus money . there is no consideration of smiles to be zakaat... thats like saying next time my zakaat is due ill pay it in smiles...ummmmm -

a smile is a kind act ---- “Do not look down on any act of kindness, even if it is just meeting your brother with a pleasant smile on your face.” [Sahih Muslim]

Fred wrote:

To give Zakaat (obligatory charity),

Is making a sad person happy a form of charity?
Narrow interpretations are fine for lawyers.

Hello everyone,

Just to inform you that this thread has been moved to the Expat cafe - Open discussions category of the forum.

cheers,
Bhavna

rareshine wrote:

obligatory charity = ZAKAAT is clear that it is 2.5% of your surplus money . there is no consideration of smiles to be zakaat..

Doesn't mean you can't add a few where possible.
Surplus money - Does that mean surplus before or after luxury products you buy?

I have a new car, so my luxury item means I have less surplus, so can get away with giving less to those in need, yet remain within the rules.
Yippee, I got my car 2.5% cheaper as I no longer have to pay zakat on that cash.
Would that cover the spirit of zakat, or just cover the stated requirements?

I read somewhere charity was about helping people, as well as purifying yourself from greed (For Muslims).
I've already used the car to put a smile on several faces, helping a group out with transport when they were stuck.
Next week I'm using it to take a bunch of kids on a day out that would be impossible without me.
Both use resources including fuel and wear on the vehicle, all at my personal cost.
Is that zakat?

As I said, narrow definitions are for lawyers.

Oh, almost forgot.
I'm also going to use the car to visit a school for the poor.

They get a free English lesson and, if I do the job properly, a large smile, but I don't charge a fee of any sort, so I don't have to pay my 2.5% on what I would have made at a fee paying gig, and I get the bonus of removing the petrol costs from my 2.5% surplus.

Perhaps I should charge them for the day and pay my 2.5% zakat on the fee, or are those smiles worth my loss of cash, and is the time I give for free a form of zakat?

2.5% to charity, or giving 100% to charity by not charging, but I'm not sticking to the narrow definition of the rules.
Which is better?

@Fred,

Narrowing a definition is one thing and blowing things out of proportion is completely other.

Zakat is a systemized obligation that's limited to 2.5% of annual surplus to be given to very clearly defined people (masakeen). Nothing more nothing less.

Everything you have said like making people smille, helping the poor, etc. is all SADQA. That's a completely different thing from Zakat. There are no limits to Sadqa. You can do it as more as you can/like.

And yes: there is no mathematical or logical relationship between the two. Giving 1 billion bucks in sadqa doesn't save you a single penny from your 2.5%.

thank you...he was driving a point that he never had and..... drew it into the ground....

TheLegendLeads wrote:

@Fred,

Narrowing a definition is one thing and blowing things out of proportion is completely other.

Zakat is a systemized obligation that's limited to 2.5% of annual surplus to be given to very clearly defined people (masakeen). Nothing more nothing less.

Everything you have said like making people smille, helping the poor, etc. is all SADQA. That's a completely different thing from Zakat. There are no limits to Sadqa. You can do it as more as you can/like.

And yes: there is no mathematical or logical relationship between the two. Giving 1 billion bucks in sadqa doesn't save you a single penny from your 2.5%.

and the OP disappears....

Thanks dudes for your contributions.

Fred you are a wonderful guy and you are strongly aware that our connection with other humans is key in defining who we are. Your mind has went through into the essence of these rituals and you realized the goal and you are working on them in a daily basis.

The other fellows, I do respect your perspective on matters and it is really great that you all realize that what he was talking about is Sadaqa and not Zakat, and this is things related to jurisprudence which some people may regard as mere semantics.

My fellows, what happened here is what also makes us lose focus a lot. You people went on debating on very different things and you weirdly got into the details of other matters.

Wish you all the best and please if one feels that he answered something pertinent to the question, so please don't drag yourself to other arguments in a place that is not calling for it.