More red flags hinting at PR's future?

seoulguy wrote:

Those who've committed to PR one way or another and those contemplating it (including myself, but less every day), should pay attention to Padilla's televised address tonight.  See if you can detect the winds of bank runs or shutdowns.

Apparently the sales tax is to go up to 11.5% on Wednesday (how in the world will low-income households [the majority of PR families?] make it) with a 4% on services (would affect my business) and VAT later on.

The El nino year will put PR square in the kill zone for water rationing.

With a ten-year economic slump, crime that won't quite and these new problems, who among you are ready to throw in the towel?  Is being warm worth the price?

DM

I am still heading home (PR), one way or another when the time comes. While PR has problems, other Latin American countries have it worst.

Hi Seoulguy & ReyP,

I am here now and have only been here for a month.  I was in AZ before.  The same thing is happening there.  I believe in other places there is more cushion and different types of distraction. Perhaps because I live in the Stella neighborhood in Rincon, I don't see crime in the same way as someone in San Juan.  There are poor people.  I chose not to live in San Juan for many reasons.  I know it is much worse. My neighbors work hard, play dominoes and loteria, but still care for what they have. None of them have a lot of money and they live simply. 

I thought the tax price had already gone up? I don't buy anything but food anyway.  The government subsidizes so much it is hard to tell the real cost of anything anywhere.  What I've learned here is that milk is really expensive!  I don't need a car so I don't deal with that crap, coffee is better and cheaper than in AZ, food is usually about the same price.  My rental is cheaper.  My neighbors are great.  My electric and water are about the same.

I work from home as a consultant.  I am not sure how taxes would affect me.  I haven't registered a business here.

I will certainly watch the address though.

thanks,

Liz

I appreciate the reply from Liz.

None of my business, but where in AZ are you from? Is Oracle a clue? 

Also wondering how you think you will fare without a car in PR?  If you're in Rincon, then Aguadilla would be the nearest resource for medical care (I suppose if you're under 65, you don't think you'll ever need it).  Also, what chain shopping, i.e., Amigo, Pueblo, is in Rincon.  I thought there was none.  How did you even get to Rincon from the Isla Verde airport?

I would consider Rincon, Cabo Rojo or Rio Grande/Fajardo, too, but I don't drive, and do not want to be trapped in one location.  Also when I asked a recommended realtor for long-term rental options under $1000, she wouldn't give me the time of day.

Maybe you have kept your banking in the US.  Years ago (many, many years ago), I did my banking w/Banco Popular -- a bad idea.  If you have local banking, when the "default shoe" drops, the sound you hear will be the slamming of banking doors.

D

Yeah, you're right seoulguy, PuertoRico really sucks.Better stay in AZ.

I'm waiting to hear more about the tax increase and how people are faring with it.  As Mac had asked on another thread, does this include food to be taxes?

Liz, I love your view on life in Puerto Rico for the many Puerto Ricans who live, love and stay here. I am a recent arrival( last year in May) and have joined in the simple way people live here. We were lucky to find a beautiful home to rent and since we were without a car for 6 months had easy access to town (Quebradilla) by taking a nice walk for about a mile. My husband was born in San German and had wanted to come here to retire and live the rest of his life here. I being a Newyorican was very hesitant to come and live here again since we lived here over 40 years ago when hubby was stationed at Ramey Air Force Base.

He had asked me if I wanted to go to Aguadilla to live and since I remember it as it was, didn't want to but now I see how much it has grown. It truly is a hub of activity.  Luckily where we are, we have easy access to Isabela, Aguadilla, Mayaquez and going the other was, to Camuy, Hatillo and Arecibo. I have learned to love it here and the peaceful existance we have. 

As my hubby said that what did we do when we lived on Long Island where we had a 2 room apartment and had to be indoors much of the time in winter, here we have great air being up on a hill in the country. I know that things are not going good for the government here but we are happy to walk into town, play dominoes on our porch or simply read a book while getting the best air in the world.

Happy to be in Puerto Rico!!!

Tonie

Thank you, tonie, for your perspective on living in PR.  Everyone has a different point of view from where they are coming from and I appreciate your view in enjoying the simpler lifestyle which we would also, want for ourselves in PR.

Hi Schuttzie,
   I know that you will enjoy life here. You make it what you want to. We are very happy here and don't plan to return to the US except for visits. I have 6 of my grandkids there so we will make some trips but happy to be coma a true Boricua!!!

So happy for you!  Yes, it is what you make it wherever you are in this world.  Much respect and blessings to you both!

Good post. Very informative. So I have a small home in Rincon and am in the process of building another small home (on the same property). The home we are constructing is being built with as many energy and water efficient processes as possible. Obviously I have concerns for the island relating to crime,energy costs and the economy, but me feeling is that over the next decade there will either be major change in these areas OR the millions of "ex Puertoricans" will watch their island parents and heritage crumble into an abyss like Haiti.

I am able to rent the one house with no problem. Some of your post discussed farming and self sufficiency. I wanted to know if you had and any business ideas that I could look into as an ex-pat.

I am selling my home in New York and want to become homesteaded in PR to take advantage of Act 22 and 20.

Is there any internet or simple ways to make extra income? Are there any services that we (my wife and I) may want to start researching prior to our permanent move in 2 years??

I want to really just subsidize our pension with something extra. I would love if it its was environment related or holistic or even agricultural.

My computer skills are fair but I learn quickly. My wife and I are just burnt out of the NY rat race, we have no children and life is too short.

Do you see anything on the horizon that may be a wise area to look into?

Sorry for the broad question.

Steve M

I'm appreciate of the reply, although I don't know which post you've chosen.

I see that you're a realist, so over the next two years, watch the situation very closely.  I have experience on the island in the 70s, totally different.  You could make a "go" of it then, but minor inconveniences have turned into intractable or even
life-threatening problems today.  I don't see an end to it; and don't expect the waste-of-space politicians to fix it; that's not their job, ironically.

As to the Internet, it took me 12 years to have a thriving business I can barely keep up with alone, so you can bet on a long wait before the profits start rolling in.  Again, if you're a realist, you'll understand that.

D

My husband and I move to PR in January.  We started out our adventure in Old San Juan, we are now moving to Fajardfo; more space for less money.  We have learned to live with less.  We now realize all the "stuff" we had back in the States was just that .... stuff.  You must move here with a lot of patience or you will never make it.  We didn't have a car initially because living in Old San Juan is a nightmare to find parking.  But, once we starting looking for places outside the old city we had to get a car.  There is public transportation here, but very erratic and not real schedule to tell you what bus goes where and if you don't speak the language, like we don't, it's difficult to get information on what bus to catch.  We have ridden a few times and now are pretty comfortable in getting where we need to go; but we mostly just relax.  The tax hike won't effect us too much because we only have to buy food and gas for the vehicle occasionally for times when we go out exploring.  There are so many beautiful places on the island to live.  I too had the experience with a realtor when I told her our budget, never heard back from her.  But I learned from the person who referred her to me that she is very helpful to anyone moving here to work at the base or if you are spending big money.  Living here for these past few months has truly been a learning experience.  I'm starting a Facebook blog on What's going on in Puerto Rico to try to help out other expats learn without too much trial and error.

I will be in Fajardo this coming week, how far along are you on your move to Fajardo?
By the way, since there are a lot of expats in Rincon, I decided to try contacting a realtor in Rincon via email, and the guy send me a link to his web site listing and ask me to contact him if I saw something I like. I found him rude and all the properties way overpriced. I think they imagine that Americans are dumb or desperate.
Technically PR home sellers should be desperate given the current financial situation, I think realtors talk them into selling at very high prices. There are a lot of for sale houses in that small island and if they keep listening to the realtors, some will make a lot of money, but most will simply collect moss. We can wait to move and prices to come down.
My first priority was Fajardo, Ceiba, Luquillo any way so no great loss.

By the way if you are a handy man there are a LOT of foreclosed homes that can be gotten for a song from the banks as they are not moving and banks first priority is to get the money leftover from the original mortgage, sure they would prefer more, but will settle easy.

I agree with you Rey.  Living in Rincon, I see that the Americanos who come here have more money, so they may get catered to by realtors.  I didn't go to a realtor at all.  I asked around, looked on craigslist.  My landlord is Puerto Rican.  While he is in the states, his mum is a block from me and keeps an eye out for us.  We have a great neighborhood of poorer, working-class people.  Everything, for us, is within walking distance (for dCarterBristoe).  The kids and I got bikes.  We rent a car for when we have to do business in San Juan.  For me, it's cheaper that way then having car payment or maintenance.

So, I haven't bought anything...yet, but have definitely learned...no realtors!!

We won't be moving to Fajardo until the end of the month.    Someone suggested Rincon to us and it was on list of places to look, but we found this place and the size and price was what we were looking for.  We found a car and just paid cash, not the we need it daily but liked being able to go when we wanted to and not wait on a bus or have to come in early because of the bus schedule.

I think it was me who suggested Rincon.  Yea, eventually we will get a car (if we can pay cash), as it is nice to be able to go to another town and visit things.

Whoever Rey is, he's right. The recommended realtor in Rincon wouldn't give me the time of day when I suggested a $1000 price as a monthly rent (I was lying, anyway, as I'd never come close to paying this in PR).  And right again, gringos bring prices up, not down, so even though nice, I'd have to stay away from Rincon.  Just for fun you should check Las Vegas on Zillow and look at the under $50K properties; there are scads of zombie foreclosures,, 2/3/4 BR condos, some in decent neighborhoods and even some furnished.  So, yes, the home prices in PR are inflated for some strange reason.

We finish building our house in Sabana Grande, I was looking at house prices before deciding in building and found the prices to be all over. One of the reasons in the area (city vs. country) also if you ask a realtor the prices seems to increase. My suggestion will be to shop around, ask the people in the area you are interested in and check the "clasificados en linea". Once you find something you like bargain directly with the owners, you will be surprise how much you can save. I have been looking into rentals for a friend of mine wanting to move to PR, in our area (west) you can find a house for as low $400/month, plus the cost of utilities seems to be lower away from the big cities.

Good Luck in you search!!

if you don't mind living in the country, you can go lower than $400/mo. I'm literally a 9 minute drive from the beaches (Rincon) and pay $275, for a 2br, on 6.5 acres. very quiet, very fresh.

I will agree with Mac00677, you can find good rental prices if you are willing to move away from the beach and big cities. I think a lot of people here seems to forger the island is only 35 miles x 100 miles, even if you move to "el campo" you are less than an hour away from the coast. Plus the weather will be cooler, utilities will be lower (less use of A/C) and you can buy fresh fruit or have it grow on your own backyard. Plus it will be quitter that in a big city or closer to the beach since the beaches are always full during the weekends.

I build our home in "el campo", we have bananas, avocadoes, coconuts, mangos and a bunch of other fruits and vegetables growing in our backyard. Plus, the ones that I may not grow, my neighbor does and we just trade. once we move there permanently, I am planning on raising chickens for eggs and meat.

Try to do that in the city.....

why would you go through a realtor to rent? NO NO NO! This isn't Kansas, Toto! clasificadosonline.com If you see a place you like, written in Spanish, translate it, using the Google chrome browser; contact them in English, and state you are willing to rent for 1yr (most contracts here are for 6months) almost all will be motivated to bring already low prices lower than advertised! Unless it's an exceptional property, I'd consider $500 to be a maximum rental price.

Great ideas, Mac!

mac,

Nothing I'd like better than to sequester myself in the country.  I speak, read and write Spanish, after many years in PR and Mexico, starting in the 70s.  Yeah, rent sounds great.  So, what's the problem. I don't drive, and even if I had a license, I couldn't afford the upkeep on a car.  That puts me right in the kill zone -- San Juan, and that's why, unfortunately, PR is out of the question.

DM

seoulguy wrote:

mac,

Nothing I'd like better than to sequester myself in the country.  I speak, read and write Spanish, after many years in PR and Mexico, starting in the 70s.  Yeah, rent sounds great.  So, what's the problem. I don't drive, and even if I had a license, I couldn't afford the upkeep on a car.  That puts me right in the kill zone -- San Juan, and that's why, unfortunately, PR is out of the question.

DM

There are many coastal towns where you'd be comfortable, without living in the capitol city. I live in Rincon, and there's a hospital here, shopping center, several beaches... depends upon what your needs are; I'd not want to live anywhere outside of a city, where I had no transportation, to get to emergency services, at least. I've seen Gringos living in Guayama and here in Rincon, without a car... they rode bicycles, and it was their choice. As it is  your choice to live without a car... how do you get along without a car where you are? I'm guessing you're not in the Rep of Korea? (Seoulguy?). The thing is, rents are cheaper, but foods is a bit more. Overall, I can live more comfortably here, than I could in my home state of NH, or any of the other places I've lived.

I agree with Mac, we did the math and we can retire now if we move back to PR. If we stay in the states we cannot afford to retire until we are 65, and we do not want to wait that long! It does not means we wont work at all, just work remote part time in the island. But our expenses will be way less than they are now.

It is up to you and how you want to live. I know a lot of family and friends in the island that do not own a car, you can always rent one or ask the neighbor to drive you, as long as you develop a friendship with them.

Super good comments! I especially liked the mention of living with less, and having a lot of patience to live here. I've been here a year, and was getting the blues, but your words really helped!  Thank You!