Is 13000 MYR is sufficient for a family of 4 to live in Malaysia

Tax based on annual salary rates below will be about RM 2,110 per month

0-5,000                0%                                                 
5,000-10,000      1% (RM50 )
10,001-20,000    1%  (RM100)
20,001-35,000    5%  (RM750)
35,001-50,000   10%  (RM1,500)
50,001-70,000   16% (RM3,200)
70,001-100,000   21% (RM6,300)
100,001-250,000  24% (RM36,000)
250,001-400,000  24.5% (RM36,750)
Exceeding 400 000  25%  (+)

That leaves RM10,890. There will other deductions for medical card and possibly EPS - according to your contract.

See this thread for examples of education fees: https://www.expat.com/forum/viewtopic.php?id=477590

COL depends where you live but you could allow RM2500 for housing and RM2000 for food and bills. Kindergarten will be RM500-750 per month.

There are some big upfront fees to get the keys for housing and to enter school, but apart from that you can see you will have some savings, more if you dont need to hire a car to get to work.

No way. Don't take the offer.

Reason? Well a teacher I know with 2 kids and a wife earnt that - and with all inclusive education (free places) and still couldn't manage. Quit for and got higher pay.

If you have to pay school fees you will barely be able to afford it. And as I pointed out in another post even if you put your kids in the worst school in KL that is still 2k each kids in fees (plus lots of expenses at school plus tutors as your kids will learn very little at such a school) and you will have to pay a term in advance AND a massive deposit. With other deposits like 3.5 months rent and first months expenses do you have 15,000 USD in savings to bring along to pay for all this ? (conservative estimate).

No kids just a wife ok salary. But after tax you will get just over 11k (after the 25% flat rate period) you will spend at least 5k on school fees/school bus/misc fees (and note seriously damage your children's education as really bad school), 2 k rent at least leaving 4k for food, internet, bills, medical, transport, tutors(!)..... even being tight with money that is hard to make it worthwhile for a move from home?

My rule of thumb ok salary (gross) regardless of nationality
-single person 10k
-add wife not working +2k
-per kid +5k (at least) +7-10k if you want them to go to a good Uni later on and they are not naturally good at exams and high if they have any special needs (but most - if not all - won't accepts special,need kids sadly)

Hi Nemo,
I read your reponse for 13000 MYR for a family of 4 to live in malaysia.
Actually I am bit confused whether to accept the offer or not. I have been offered 16200 MYR per month. This includes everything, (transportation, tax, accomodation, etc). Should I accept the offer. Initially I will go alone & stay there for 6 months or so & then planning for my wife & daughter. Medical Insurance for me will be given by company & for my dependents I have to confirm. I am planning for shared accomodation intially, mostly cooked food, etc.
Please (if possible) guide me with details of my salary breakup in terms of cost of living (like accomodation, transportation, food, etc).
Please make sure your clear cut explanation will help me out in making the decision.
Your response will be appreciated.
Thanks

No.

A colleague earning 13k with a family of 4 also but with two free school places quit  early as he said not enough to live off and was lied to about the cost of living in Malaysia.

If you have to pay school fees then that is at least 8k from your pocket a month if secondary age. You can't live on the remainder and no way can save. So unless this is a career move or your children are under school age forget it. If they are babies can live on it but say one bout of dengue that is very common in kl and bye bye 5k. And often insurance wont cover much of that. So can live but a lower middle class salary not a lot.

Hi Nemo,
Thanks for your feedback. Actually my daughter is 3 years old & my wife is a teacher. I am also planning for her job. Moreover my boss is there in malaysia & he told me that you can survive. I am planning 1 year without family & after that increment & all. So still you would say no.
Thanks

You can easily survive on RM7k per month with your family here. RM750-1000 for nursery classes and then about RM2k for Class 1.

Immigration rules allow a person to have dependents here on a salary of RM5k suggesting that this salary level is sufficient. That level puts into perspective the costs vital to basic living. Anything above that can be savings or you can up your lifestyle and spend more to be comfortable and live in nicer surroundings - the choice is yours.

As the COL has risen sharply over the last year, then RM7k is sufficient for a basic lifestyle for family of 3. Living in shared accommodation and eating out will cost you under RM4k per month unless you want steak and expensive foods.

Dear Gravitas,
Thank Your very much, this will really help me in making the decision.
Again thanks

I agree with Nemodot, its not enough according to at least one Penang family who figured in the news. They are a local Chinese family, 3 kids, modest life, RM12,000 and they run out of money before the end of the month and take from their savings. Their expenses which they listed were not luxury.

The way they explained it, which i totally understand, is that you make a firm budget but its the unexpected surprises that wreck you. This is true. I have a firm budget and am very careful but i never meet it. There is always some medical, car repair, something that happens and you spend a lot more. If you didnt have the savings account already to draw the negative from, how would you meet the surprises? Life isnt a perfect math formula. Plus, lets say you budget a reserve account of RM2000. What happens is that you see that money, find something to spend it on, then when the emergency comes you are back to zero. With kids, its much worse. In this case id say RM15000-17000 is more like it now, especially with inflation in food. Everything is rising fast.

Thanks CVCO for your response, I am also bit worried about the savings but I have confirmed that medical for my entire family, visa & monthly education expense of RM1000 for my daughter will be provided by the company.
After living there for first six months alone (no family) cant I save that much.
After looking at entire scenario, please respond everyone.
thanks

Savings depend on what school you choose and where you choose to live i.e. cost of accommodation differs radically in different areas.

Hi
Actually my office is Shah Alam, 28 km from Kualalumpur city centre. Please suggest the nearby accommodation area for family & transportation facility.
Two schools I have checked, Indian International school & vikas International school. Any suggestion regarding the school.
For first month they will arrange the accommodation & then I have to manage, I am planning for shared basis for next 5-6 months till the flat tax deduction & then family will come.
Please comment.
Thanks

Getting to the schools from Shah Alam area will be difficult because of traffic and distance. It depends if you want to hire a car (need to add RM1.5k to the budget). For sharing - ibilik.my or - mudah.com.my are quite good resources. You could live in Brickfields/Bangsar/Seputeh but travel to work would then be an issue. You need to look carefully at your transportation needs. There may be buses from Sentral (Brickfields) or elsewhere.

Thanks everyone for your feedback & suggestions. Now I am clear & I have decided to move, this will help to improve my profile(a lot) & some kind of financial gain will also take place. I am summarizing up the entire thing, suggestions are yet welcome:
1. My total Income would be 16200 MYR per month.
2.After tax (MYR 4050) for first six months , the amount left will be 12150.
3. No other deductions as I have confirmed the employer.
4. Accommodation cost will be around 750MYR on sharing basis.(For first 6-7 months)
5.Food expenses will be around 750 MYR (mostly we will cook as decided with other partner)
6.Company will provide the medical insurance for all dependents coming to malaysia.
7.Visa & all other processing will be done by company.
8.Transportation they are planning for the entire group.
9.Otherwise add another 750 MYR for transportation ( In extreme case)
10.No schooling for the year 2016-2017, daughter will join the school in 2017 April.
11.Monthly I will be sending 1000 MYR to my family.
12.MYR 250 for utilities & mobile.
13.Company is also planning for mobile connection upto MYR1000 per month for expats from my level.
14.Total expense after all would be around 4000MYR.
15. Balance I would be able to save till my family comes.
16. Moreover I am also planning for my wife's teaching job, which I have already discussed with my director in malaysia.

Suggestions & comments would be appreciated.

You have forgotten to add in the tax deduction so the total is RM 8050 based on your budget.

I don't think  you will find palatable accommodation for RM750.

You need a budget for entertainment as all work and no play makes Jack a dull boy.

Providing medical coverage by employer for family - will the cost be deductible? Usually its deducted for employee as well. 

Not getting EPF is definitely a disadvantage as the employer pays 12% here (11% by employee) and the earnings are high at around 6-7% per annum.

Human cost - being separated from your family for so long is immeasurable.

You should also get full relocation costs for travel and some sort of shipment paid (air and surface), because it is rather expensive to bring essential things from home.

Home Leave - 1 round trip per year for all.

Be careful about your qualifying period for tax residency, because if you break the 182 days with a social trip of more than 14 days, the count is zero'd and starts again.

Hi,
Thanks for your prompt response. I have confirmed everything from employer, no deductions from salary for medical, relocation charges like fare & all will be paid by the company.
One trip per year to your native place with to & fro tickets are included, no deductions from salary for that. As far as entertainment is concerned, once family comes then I will decide about this part. No entertainment without family. Moreover, increment part is also there which  will come every year.
EPF is only for local residents & not for expats, confirmed by the employer.
The amount for accommodating is mentioned on the sharing basis.
Total expenses after tax would be around 8050 MYR per month for first six months but after six it would be 7240 MYR, so another 800 MYR to family part.
Once the family comes then another 1000 MYR for food & 1000 MYR for accommodation.
Please comment & suggest.
Thanks

EPF can be awarded to foreigners as a perk. But of course employers don't mention this. Its easy to withdraw when leaving the country as well.

You have left out the school fees which you should allow RM2k per month in total as a minimum figure and RM4 for a good quality British curriculum school at Level 1-2.

I know the EPF part but still the discussion of perks for expats is under progress, they are planning for some kind of annual bonus. Moreover about school, I am planning for her admission in 2017 when she turns 5. So school fees I am not counting rt now.
I have seen the website of Vikas International school & Indian international school fees is around 1000 MYR per month for Grade1-2.
Please suggest & comment.

They do have the Indian curriculum but GIIS gets bad press as having unqualified teachers. But of course the staff change all the time. There is also Havil  International close by to Brickfields, but I think it has UK curriculum. You get what you pay for is a reasonable motto.

Thanks
What kind of school Tenby International School is. Is it good for Indian student as I have seen the fees structure as 5260 MYR one time (2160 is refundable) & 2160 per semester (comes as 540 MYR per month).
Please comment.
Thanks

No idea where you got those fees - the school in Selangor costs more:

Based on class I

800 application fee (i.e. testing) -  non refundable
4,000  - registration fee - non refundable
5,040  Fees Per Term (RM) 3 Terms A Year
5,040 Deposit i.e. one term in advance - refundable

Total on admission RM14 480

Cost per term thereafter 5 040 i.e. 15,120 per year (but note Class 5 costs 8,250 per term).

Per month RM 1260

http://www.tenby.edu.my/setia-eco-park

Fees do not include books, uniform, transportation, food, CCAs, educational visits and external examination fees

http://www.tenby.edu.my/setia-eco-park/ … procedures

Cambridge (UK) curriculum taught in English - but taught in Malaysian language for senior classes

Please see the link
http://www.tenby.edu.my/ipoh/fees1

So you are going to be working in Ipoh?

i.e. Ipoh is 2.5 hrs by road north of Kuala Lumpur.

Hi gravitas
My husband has been offered for IT Ptoject manager role170000 per annum I have 2 kids one in KG one in primary . Can you let me know what will be my husbands take home is this a good package

Zero after paying school fees!

You must ask for school fees to be paid.

Byw the average expat middel manager salary in 2015 was 60,000 RM per month. That's not a typo.

For an IT project manager role that seems low.

You mean Sixty thousand RM per month ???? We were told the max by various other companies were 180000 RM per year . My husband is a 13 years exp

Wat will
Be monthly school fees ? They told 2000 for 2 kids is it true ? Or will it be more ? Wat will be the tax for us ?

Is RM2000 for a local school? Most international schools charge a lot more than that, probably around RM3k to 3.5k per child. Sorry there may be schools a lot cheaper than that, but I am not familiar with them. Have you done a search on schools in KL and checked the fees?

hello dear All

I am going to sign offer for the job in Malaysia.
Can i get the information related to living cost .
What is the rent of 1bhk flat?
What is the food cost for family 5 members?
Which month school Admission starts ?
What will be the start date of school?
What is fees for KG1 and Class -V ?
Can we pay the fees on monthly installment ?

So that we will plan it.
warm regards
Vijay Bhagat

Hello, this is Ajay from India. I read your strings of posts and I am also in a same situation like yours. I understand you explored the cost around  ~ 5 years back. What would be cost of living now - imagining the family of hisband, spouse, two daughters (aged 8 & 12).

Thanks and look forward to hearing from you.

Nemodot wrote:

Zero after paying school fees!

You must ask for school fees to be paid.

Byw the average expat middel manager salary in 2015 was 60,000 RM per month. That's not a typo.

For an IT project manager role that seems low.

Hi Nemodot,

What should be the reasonable pay for a qualified engineer with more than 25 years of experience ? The company I am discussing with are offering a General Manager position reporting to the Managing Director ... Their web site looks well constructed and their reference list shows they are doing quite a bit of work ...A reply shall be highly appreciated...Thanks

Honestly? You can but you're gonna have to be thrifty. Why?

Lets take this into account your average monthly expenses:

RM4000/m rent
RM2000/m for a RM150,000 Kia Optima (Toyota Camrys and Honda Accords will set you back RM200,000)
International school fees for 4 kids? Sorry you'd have to forego this. You can only afford to send your kids to public schools.

Now, that's already half of what you earn at RM13k. RM7k for the wife and kids ain't gonna be enough!

Nemodot wrote:

Zero after paying school fees!

You must ask for school fees to be paid.

Byw the average expat middel manager salary in 2015 was 60,000 RM per month. That's not a typo.

For an IT project manager role that seems low.

Sorry but that is not true. TM bosses are paid 60k. Unless you're of the top tier expat then yes. Don't forget, TM is a public listed company.

Top tier here meaning you're ex BCG/McKinsey or graduated from top MBA schools like Insead and have been headhunted for a top level management position at a major listed company.

andidips wrote:

Nemodot wrote:

Zero after paying school fees!

You must ask for school fees to be paid.

Byw the average expat middel manager salary in 2015 was 60,000 RM per month. That's not a typo.

For an IT project manager role that seems low.

Hi Nemodot,

What should be the reasonable pay for a qualified engineer with more than 25 years of experience ? The company I am discussing with are offering a General Manager position reporting to the Managing Director ... Their web site looks well constructed and their reference list shows they are doing quite a bit of work ...A reply shall be highly appreciated...Thanks

100,000 USD. Or what you earn plus school fees all paid, plus all medical  flights and accommodation.

After the appalling treatment of foreigners in Malaysia recently I suggest you stay away from Malaysia.

Incorrect  top bosses earn 2 - 10 million a year. I dod some recruitment before and I know the rates.

The above does include "commissions" though..... not available to new foreigners so they need a higher base salary. By commissions old timers know what I mean.

I am talking real expats here. Not people working to travel, that's cool if young, but for someone serious about their career anything under 35,000 rm per month in Malaysia is  just bad.

Hey Nemodot , you may want to highlight on which domain/work group is Malaysia giving 35000 RM to an expat , I pressume its very rare and top priority/critical job area . also , i think when you say expat you must be referring to foreigner coming from first world like US or UK where the currency is higher than Malaysia.

Otherwise it seems misleading and gives wrong set of expectation for anyone trying to find work in malaysia. Malaysia caters to lot of different working sector and the benefits and perks varies accordingly.

this is my personal calculation (before planning to shift to malaysia or any country , one should validate if he/she will be saving atleast 2X or 3X than what he was saving in his home country + standard of living , etc)

Nope. I am referring to a family of 4 as stated in the question and I know many Indonesians, Vietnamese and Indian expats who are high earners - usually oil and gas or OMBs. They would not work for 13k. 35k salary (sole breadwinner) is the bare min to support a family of 4 comfortably. Possible on less buy means quality of life compromises.... if you are 23 and single then 8 to 10 is is good enough. It does depend. I was referring to the original question.

The trouble is properly paid Expats often don't hang out on facebook or forums. By their very nature they are working, in the Selangor club (and boy that's a 100k fee now but worth it) or at home with their families. Or indeed the Malaysian business middle class. They don't think 35k a month is big money.

35k plus family income is people in finance, proper IT professionals (lower end workers do get paid a lot less I know, one of my Indonesian friends only gets 15k a month and whines on about it) and teaching couples for example. Teachers in the proper international schools get 20 to 25k (more with management allowances) and often work as teaching couples, a 40 to 50k combined income does give a reasonable middle class lifestyle with 2 kids (free school places  medical and housing). Not luxury but good enough.

13k with with a family of 4. Maybe 40 years ago not now (I first worked in Malaysia 20 years ago and Malaysian middle managers struggled on 12 to 15k a month with kids) but now no way. Obviously if unemployed any salary is good  so again circumstances matter. So dies having family nearby, as getting stuck in a foreign country sucks etc.

What makes the Selangor Club worth RM100k joining fee?  I thought about joining the Royal Lake Club a few years ago and the join fee was around RM15k per year with monthly fees. Apart from using the facilities like the restaurant, pool, tennis courts (which some condos already have) then I couldn't see the point of joining except for a car badge or sticker for the windscreen.