Anybody living in Vilcabamba or Loja?

xoie wrote:

So strange, everyone keeps talking about how cold Cuenca is. I've been here a month and every day feels hot to me. The sun is very intense. I wear short sleeves and can't believe all the locals with their sweaters. I have to wear a hat and sunglasses the sun is so intense. Of course I'm from cold, gloomy Michigan so maybe that's why. I look forward to the cooler months (July, August and sept) when I can experience some fall like weather and actually wear my sweaters.

Just a little hello *waving* from cold Michigan, xoie.  I am planning a move this summer to Cuenca area and it's cool to know there's a fellow Michigander already there.  That's my destination but really who knows where I end up once I've done a bit of travelling there.  I'm just picking up and moving so am flying by the seat of my pants.  Maybe I'll get to see you once I'm there! Would love to hear your perspective on your move as a person coming from here.

Egyirba

The first thing that you must know about me is that I am still living in Charlotte, NC.

I am moving to Cuenca in May.  Cuenca has always been my goal.  But I am reading more about Loja and will be looking into it.

But...as a newbie to Ecuador, I plan to stay in Cuenca for at least a year.  I want some time to finalize my paperwork and get settled before jumping off to another city.

I am reasonably sure that any other city would have to be a 'suburb' of Cuenca.  I have no interest in living near Quito or Guayaquil - they are too big/busy for me.

Vilcabamba:
I have a friend that I met online who moved there in September 2013.  We email and talk (a lot) about her experiences.  The biggest thing that she has pointed out to me is that a lot of  the ex-pats who live there are 'New Agers' and are into crystals and reading signs of the moon and starts and such.  While I know that this is only information that I am hearing about Vilca from one person, since I know that Vilca is small, I will give a lot of credence to what she has been telling me.  Also, too many of the ex-pats are non-forgiving about the lack of English spoken, but, worse, are rude.

She has a medical condition that will be with her the rest of her life.  The 'New Agers' give her a lot of flack over her lifestyle: she dares to eat meat, she uses the local vendors, she is trying to learn Spanish???  They tell her to become like them and she will become healthy and content.

They do not know Spanish and refuse to learn it - and some of them have been there over four YEARS!.

She is also bored - there really is nothing to do in Vilca (unless you want to dance in the moonlight in the woods).  And medical care is much less available than Loja or Cuenca.

She has been to Cuenca and thinks that it is a 'big city' and does not really want to move there.

I would not be surprised to find out the Loja is a better city for her and me.  I think that once she feels settled in with all of her paperwork being done and having her financial expenses settle down, she would be amenable to moving to Loja.  We seem to be becoming friends (who have yet to meet face-to-face), so I could see me moving to Loja, also.

In the USA, quite often, a small town is a suburb of a larger city---and with our cars, it could be a 20-30 minute drive to the downtown of the larger city.  In Ecuador, it could be a 30 minute - four hour bus ride to do that same trip since roads are not the same, we tend not to have cars and distances are much greater between the small city and the larger city.

So, Vilca is out for me.  Loja is a strong possibility even though it is a long bus ride to Cuenca.  But, I would only be going to Cuenca sporadically (maybe some shopping specifics or going for a cultural event.)

Regretfully, you can find a lot more info on Cuenca and very little 'on the ground' info for Loja or Vilca.  Personally, I prefer to think that the ex-pats in Loja have found they are in heaven and either (1) want to keep it for themselves  or (2) they have so much to do with their lives that they do not take the time to post continuous blogs. (LOL)

I did forward these postings to her and I hope that she will feel comfortable passing on her personal experiences.

If I said anything here to offend anyone, I apologize.  If I mis-stated anything that I think she has been telling me, I apologize.

It would be lovely to hear more from ex-pats in either city...

Lifestyles and finances are so subjective, it is hard to read between the lines.  Here is hoping everyone finds their own perfect city to enjoy.

Denise
Charlotte NC

Denise,

I lived in Loja Ecuador about two years, but returned to the U.S. at the end of last year because of medical complications. I don't post here very often anymore, but still get emails about the threads in which I posted in the past. I think your message deserves a response.

Not, it is not true that there a lots of expats in Loja who think they have found heaven. In the two years I was there, I never personally met any local expats, but know (thorough friends) there were at least two others. On the other hand I saw lots of expats from Vilcabamba at the Loja SuperMaxi. They came up to shop. I was never moved to introduce myself to any of them.

About Vilcabamba: the clearest impression I get is that it is a clash of the worst of Expat (American or otherwise) culture with the worst of Ecuadorian culture. I find it a most unpleasant place. Much worse than the small towns you might find outside of many American foreign bases, but with even more challenging downsides. I would be remiss, however, if I did not point out that a number of people have stated unequivocally that they love Vilcabamba and are very happy living there. It does arguably have the best weather in Ecuador (and much of the world, for that matter). If you think Vilcabamba is interesting, and speak Spanish, look 15 minutes north to Malacatos. A world of difference, yet similar weather. I did not see any expats living there whenever I visited. My Ecuadorian family's grandmother lives there and we visited often.

Loja is a decidedly ecuadorian city with minor expat influence, so a good place to experience Ecuadorian culture. I lived with a family there; they adopted me (a long story). It will probably remain one of the best experiences in my life. But, you will have to embrace a different way of looking at things. It takes an open mind and heart to adjust, but it is well worth the effort. I would return, and may, if my health were to improve. Health is the first challenge of living in any but the three largest cities. Health care in Ecuador is marginal at best in small cities. There are enough doctors, but the quality of service, in few cases, is appalling, if not criminal. Many of the people retiring in Ecuador are older and will eventually require quality health care. Your chances of getting that in the smaller cities is not good. The family I lived with was frequently driving me three hours (one-way) to Cuenca to get the care I needed. As is so true of Ecuadorian culture, they did this with love, joy, and humility because they treated me as a family member. And, while the Cuenca doctors are often American-trained and very good, diagnostic tools are a bit limited and some higher-end medical treatments and medicines are scarce if available, at all. Admittedly, I do have some unique and quite serious problems. Hopefully you are blessed with good genes and few medical challenges. Wherever you decide to settle in Ecuador, I urge you to get to know and understand the medical offerings that are available to you at that location. It is primarily because if this that I usually recommend most people consider Cuenca as a first choice. The City is beautiful and health options are arguably the best in Ecuador. And, truthfully, I love that city above all the others, and I visited most. I consciously chose Loja because I wanted to learn to become Ecuadorian without the distraction of (some, but not all) expats and their cultural biases. I did, and will never regret what I learned.

Finally, I would encourage anyone and everyone to do their best to learn Spanish. I know that some live without this, but their experience is definitely different, and less for it. The non-Spanish speaking expats are usually the ones most often criticizing Ecuadorians. But, one must remember: language and the culture go hand and hand, and the most beautiful thing Ecuador has to offer is the culture IMHO. But, as I alluded to before, the culture is contrary to American-thinking and will require the ability to be open and honest with others and yourself. Do so, and maybe your will find heaven in (where-ever-you-are-in-Ecuador). maybe even in Loja.

I wish for you, an extraordinary experience in your adventures in Ecuador.

Hello Joseph,

It's great to see you posting on this forum again.  Your earlier observations were fundamental to the successful planning of our inaugural Ecuadorian visit a year ago (a few days in Quito, six weeks in Loja and with side trips to Cuenca, Malacatos, Vilcabamba, Olon and Montanita).  My wife and I will be returning in early April for a couple of months and will revisit the above areas, as well as seeing as much additional, lovely country as we can.

I share your perspectives exactly regarding Loja city and its wonderful people, Vilcabamba (and its unsavoury gringos) and the lovely, calm Malacatos.  We were privileged to meet and spend much time with Ecuadorian families in both Loja and the Malacatos area and, as a result, had our visit transformed by their consideration, decency and trust.  We soon felt not at all like tourists.

Again, thanks for checking in, Joseph; I've been wanting to thank you for your thoughtful and incisive perspectives and for taking the time to share your insights with others.  It made a big difference to us and I sincerely hope that your health permits you a speedy return to the land, the people and the 'adoptive' family which you so obviously love.

I'm sure they all feel the same toward you.

Sincerely,
Robert

Robert,

What a beautiful post. I am sure that most of the posters here are happy to see that our comments are read and help others to discover Ecuador in such a satisfying fashion. I would like to tip my hat to you because you are also part of the equation of success. We post, we read, we learn, we act AS A COMMUNITY to serve each other. How Ecuadorian is that. And, yes, I have a new family which has brought me the extraordinary experience of unconditional love. In unconditional love, there is no I, no ego; only love. May we all have that experience. Thanks so much, Robert.

May I ask in which part of the U.S. you currently reside?

We are Canadian, currently spending time in S. Texas.

Saint Petersburg Florida

Well, you're warm.

If, at any time, you'd care to PM or exchange email addresses, I'd enjoy communicating.  If this is not your preference, I fully understand.

Hello,

I would like to ask You, is here a mobile phone network coverage in Vilcabamba? Thank YOu very much for Your responses, it is very important... Andrea

I'm glad to see this thread is alive and well. I am a recent university graduate who originally planned to come to Ecuador to visit a friend in the Peace Corps. She is working as an English Teacher's Assistant in Zamora, but informed me of an opening in another school close by. I am currently in Loja waiting to hear back from the school directors as to when I might be able to give a sample lesson for the students in order to then (hopefully!) receive a placement in either Loja or Zamora. I found this thread while trying to do a little research on Loja and the surrounding towns.

I would just like to say Thank You to Joseph K, who has provided a wealth of useful information on Loja. It's a shame your health has prevented you from staying in Loja; I hope all the best for you in terms of your health.

Something I have been wondering about:
*Both Joseph and Robert mention spending time with Ecuadorian families - I am currently staying in Hotel Podocarpus, which, although reasonably priced, is definitely above my means as a recent graduate without a job. How would I go about finding accommodation such as a host family for the long term?

Hello Emilia,

My involvement with Lojan families was not in a 'host/guest' capacity but, rather, just as a new friend who participated socially with them over a six-week period.  And I'm afraid that my initial connection to them was just one of those fortuitous, unplanned things where one social introduction led to another and to another...and a solid friendship formed.

Emilia Sz wrote:

How would I go about finding accommodation such as a host family for the long term?

I have never known a Spanish school that didnŽt offer this service. Of course, you may have to be a Spanish student to take advantage of it.  So the question is, are there any Spanish schools in Loja-

hello global woman! I am new on here, but just want to say I find your sense of adventure and willingness to just get up and go refreshing! I too want to make the move to ecuador sometime soon. I work in windsor , ontario, but live in chatham, I am sure you know where that is. I have of course been to detroit and michigan many times.  pLEASE KEEP POSTING IF YOU CAN, I LIKE TO LEARN ALL i CAN ABOUT eCUADOR.

The Good Sides:

So I just came back after spending a week in Vilcabamba and I have to admit the climate really is perfect. Even while it was raining I could comfortably walk outside shirtless without feeling cold.

Vilcabamban locals are nice and helpful people atleast more so than Lima Peruvians but this is generally true about any small town.

Vilcabamba along with south of Ecuador contains some of the most spectacular and scenic lush green mountains and valleys with great diversity and some of the most comfortable climates.

The Down Sides:

Food is relatively expensive for Ecuador as avocados cost as much as 40-50 cents each and coconuts cost 1.25 each but I'm told food is a bit cheaper in Loja or Malacatos, however it's still cheaper than the US.

Food is mostly conventionally produced with pesticides and other chemicals.

The amount of mosquitos and random tiny biting flies which also leave an itchy swollen bump that I have not read about prior to arriving however you can feel the bite of the tiny flies. If anyone has an effective natural repellent that would be useful, I would appreciate that

The biggest downside is the amount of ignorant Americans moving down there who usually are too poor to afford a half decent retirement life in the US, often these are the uneducated Americans that give the rest of the Americans a bad name.

The price of land and property is expensive for an Andean location in Latin America.

Joseph

So sorry to read that you had to return to the States. Hope that you will become well enough to return to Loja.

Sue

I live in vilcabamba.
Its gringo land. basically not ecuador as you would know it.
some love it some dont. I love it. only problem I see is prices go up along with our usual western issues as well. vilcabamba might be the most pricey place to live in ecuador.
locals cannot even afford buying the land here.
but the place is beautiful. very relaxed. you can have good conversations in town with friendly people. we got some pretty ok restaurants. weather is amazing. and lots of stuff to do here. always something happening. yoga, arts etc.
the community is alive and well. you will know everybody in 1 month.
go check it out

yes. and internet too.

Ver few Americans at leat, thank goodness. elevation too high and worst kinds of snakes and go get in to homes. Stay home if you're not an economic refuge if you know what I mean.

Thrall lie. If it were 68 every day some whining American exfat would want it 67 or 69. Stay home.

I saw 2 snakes in the almost 3 years here. easy to avoid. but we got small flies biting you that are worse than mosquitoes. after 6 months my body got used to them and I react less. but you dont wanna walk in nature in shorts.
I lived in tropics before here and liked it better than this weather here. it gets cold at certain times a year in the evenings. one needs a jacket. nothing really serious but im just spoiled with tropical climate for decades. but most would say tropics are too hot, and if so this is perfect.
Air is fresh all the time. Sun is strong due to elevation and equator. getting your vitamin d3 is easy here

We should have learned more Spanish before we actually came to Ecuador, but, here we are at Hotel  jardines del rio in Loja for a few more days .  Nice people here,  and it is a good hotel. It would have been better to have obtained  information from experienced English speaking people before we came. And it sure would be good now, to be able to converse in English with someone who could save us from possible bad experiences.

Hi, hubby and I live in Piura-Peru but are planning on moving to Ecuador (seems  more clean and organized). We will be in Loja next week. We have never been in Loja. Does anybody know about a church with English services? We have small children (they speak Spanish), How about recommending a good school? What neighborhoods in Loja are good to buy a house and which one to avoid?

We are also considering Salinas.

globalwoman wrote:

Just a little hello *waving* from cold Michigan, xoie.  I am planning a move this summer to Cuenca area and it's cool to know there's a fellow Michigander already there.  That's my destination but really who knows where I end up once I've done a bit of travelling there.  I'm just picking up and moving so am flying by the seat of my pants.  Maybe I'll get to see you once I'm there! Would love to hear your perspective on your move as a person coming from here.

Egyirba

Definitely!  Contact me once you're in town and we can meet for coffee or something!

I am an American living in Loja. Contact me when you come and I'll help anyway I can.

Dave

[email protected]

Let me know, Dave what you know about living in Loja, are you working and some things you like and the downsides.  I have lived in QUito for three years now and love the city .  However, when I visited Loja 2 years ago for 10 days I was attracted to the outdoor life in Loja, the small-town feel, I like Lojanos very much and know some here in QUito  (I live in the U.S.  in  rural Oregon so laid-back is good), universities and I like that kind of access and life  there in Loja and access to Cuenca (4 hours North).  Please email me privately with more info as I will travel soon to Loja to sort stuff out , see what the work at the Universities is like, etc.   Thanks very much.
Susan in Quito

Hi,
I saw your remarks about Loja, and I wondered if you knew of a good real estate company there? I have lived abroad for over 10 years and also traveled Mexico and Guatemala for over 30-40 years. I speak and read Spanish and am in the process of downsizing and simplifying my life. I am most interested in the southern part of the country, and while I have a real estate connection in Vilcabamba, I have yet been able to find anyone to work with in Loja.

If you possibly can recommend someone, I would be very grateful.

Be well, be peace - and thanks!

Susan

Good Morning, Susan:
I s this a private message?   My name is Susan S ...? You are my tocaya, I guess --  Sometimes it is not entirely clear if this is a private message.  Let me know.    Just a note -- this may not be the information you are looking for -- I do not know anything about real estate purchaese in Loja or vilcabamba.  But I will tell you a bit about my process here. THis is NOT much like Mexico or Guatamala, by the way and South America is quite different re: politics, culture, history etc  and the language is simpler here...

Here is what I know-- I have lived in Quito for three years Nov '14 and the change here has been significant enough in this city for me to think about a big move to Loja.  It is a big move in this country.  I love QUito, the action here, my apt , the many cultural offerings and my few good friends.here and interesting activities.  I also serve on the board of the English-speaking church, Advent St Nicholas.

However,  I am going for 5 days this month to explore the southern areas again and see how I feel about this move from the northern Andean region to the Southern Andes. It is a very different part of the country. I am looking for professional work opportunities and high quality of life, less noise, better air quality etc.   Previously I enjoyed Loja for 10 days 2 years ago -- a lovely city, people and food but far from many  amenities --. 4 hours by bus from Cuenca w/ excellent medical facilities, etc. etc and some friends live there.  I got to know locals and do not want anything to do with Vilcabamba. A very lovely valley -- I  spent two days there hiking , enough for me.   Another story of overreaching gringolandia,  IMO..

FIrst:  Have you been to Ecuador?  I have lived in EUrope, Chile and Argentina, many parts of the U.S. originally from Boston and my family is now on the West Coast.  I am a Westerner and love open spaces and quiet but I also love the big city!l.  SO my experience is varied as I see yours is.

I need to tell you at this time, I am renting and not looking to buy.   I am a soltera, have no pets but want a dog and a garden space where I relocate.  Please let me know what more you need to know, I know this country quite well , it is a developing country and changing fast, so come down and let's talk!

Best regards, Sue

.

Joseph:
Are you available for consult about Loja?.  COuld we private message?   
I do not seem to grasp how to do that on this site    I hope your health challenges have improved and your life quality is better wherever you are --

Your values and ideas about expatriating expressed on these pages, as you have been told several times on this site,  are among the highest and best U.S. values, IMO.  I thank you for your extensive tips on Loja -- attitude is EVERYTHING, isn't it ?  You are making a difference to many lives as they prepare to make a MAJOR LIFE CHANGE to move to this little country.   

I live in QUito now 3 years ( 8 months in a small family-run hostal in La FLoresta where I managed to learn a great deal about many things Ecuadorian and also much about myself, of course! )I traveled to Loja  2 years ago (may 2012) was there 10 days and hiking, knew no one except my nice hotel keepers and family -- , few expats then.
DO you know the Loja area today?  what are the changes? costs update?.

  BTW,  today is Independence Day, 2014.  Happy 4th of July!   Let me know if you receive this and about the private messaging for more details about Loja before I travel  there again in mid July this year.  I am working and want to know more applying for work at the universities in Loja?

Mil gracias,
Sue in Quito.

Hi Sue

For private messaging click on little envelope icon upper right and then "send new message" on left. It is sort of self explanatory from there but let me know if you still can't figure it out.

Another
Sue

First, I'd like to thank you, Joseph, for your thoughtful and deeply helpful commentary on life in Ecuador. Also, we are fellow Floridians. I live in St. Augustine and lived for many years in Tampa/St. Pete. I so hope your health is rapidly improving and that, if it's your desire, you can return to Ecuador soon. I have a question for everyone. I am planning my first exploratory trip to Ecuador for, perhaps, December. My still nebulous plans are to fly to Cuenca, stay a few days, travel south to Lajo, and from there visit Vilcabamba and Malacatos. Then I'd like to head up to Montanita before returning to Cuenca to catch a flight back to the states. Does anyone have advice on this itinerary, including transportation options, lodging, etcetera? Any insights are most appreciated. Thank you!

We'll be doing our 3rd explore in October. (Four adults) #1=last June, #2=October 2013. We are late 50's to mid-60's.
We live on the west coast (Oregon) and always fly in GYE. then we take a bus ($8.00) to Cuenca - much cheaper than flying into Cuenca and you get to see a lot of local culture and scenery. We spent a week in Cuenca - loved it! then we went back to GYE, rented a car and headed to Salinas. Then up to Simon bolivar for a few days - hostal right on the beach. Heaven. Then up the coast day by day, over to Mindo, up to Ottavalo then down to Quito overnight (too big for us) and down Banos for a few days of soaking in thermal pools and exploring- another great place. Down the Panamerican to Cuenca - The Lonely Planet Tour book is vital as is a good map. We found a pretty good one at Barnes and Nobles - laminated and easy to fold. We did get horribly lost a couple of times but managed to find our way back. People are VERY helpful. Street/Highway signs are sometimes non existent or only marked one direction. Police are helpful - we got a friendly police escort out of Latacunga!
Last October we stayed in Cuenca for a week scouting perspective properties.
This October we'll fly to GYE, head to Cuenca, hear the Symphony for free, check out the University, head down to Loja and points south, maybe into Peru a bit. Four weeks. We stay in Hostals whenever possible.
Montanita is a party town - way to busy and noisy for us but others like it. Coastal towns we liked were Simon Bolivar, Olon, Canoa. We only went as far up the coast as Pedernales before heading inland to Mindo. I hope you have a great adventure. Learn some Spanish.

Sounds heavenly. I am fellow Oregonian. Where in Oregon are you from?

I'm in Vilcabamba right now. I have to keep pulling myself back from wanting to place a bid on the first place I have found. I have so many questions that need answering - but, as far as I can see, this is a really a great place. Costs are extremely low, and as I am retiring, I am very concerned with this aspect. There are alternative forms of health care and all are affordable. There is also an active group of foreigners who have formed an organization called Vilcabamba New World that is trying to help others to learn to adapt to their new culture, and, at the same time, provide Spanish for those who came without it and English for those who needs it to work with the newly arrived.

All and all, it seems a place of openness and tolerance. Time will tellpeace.

Hi Sue, We are in Southern Oregon, Talent, just south of Medford and near Ashland. How about you?

There are several "Sues" on this thread, so I'm hoping I am correct in believing I am the one to whom you have referred!

Presently, I'm in Vilcabamba, but my home is in Central Texas. I am here scoping out properties and the environment - and am really happy with what I am seeing here in V. It is incredibly beautiful, mesmerizing and mesmerizing.

Don't think you are referring to me >  I am Sue in Quito and we have chatted on your way into EC.... have a good trip.

woops, wrong Sue.

"woops wrong sue": -- I am Sue in QUito from Talent.  What's up?

IF you had 3-4 days in Loja and Vil what would you do? We'd like to do some hiking - perhaps with a guide. Can anyone recommend someone? We've heard of Scott's Adventure tours but have not received word back - it seems their website is down or something. What hostel would you recommend? Places to eat? Thanks in advance.