Saudis actualy liberal?

you're CERTAINLY confused because you're trying to apply your western "values" or lack thereof on a society that highly respects and regards people with morals. what you read is a bunch of western chatter on the internet about what saudis are, and mostly aren't. Since you decided to generalize a whole nation under liberals  based upon reading a few inadequately informed posts .. i'll try to help you out.

1. saudi government is adhering to the ONLY version of islam there is and that is the islam found in the Quran and the Sunnah of the Prophet Muhammad salAllaahu alayhi wa salaam. there weren't versions of islaam revealed nor practiced, so to call it an interpretation of something  is a false pretense.

The government, is only a mirror image of its people, (check your history books) therefore, the saudis are religious and fundamental in more than one aspect. Gender-mixed ANYTHING doesn't exist anywhere except on western compounds or other nonpublic places. if you mean that women mix with their fathers, brothers, uncles and family member then you're on target.  but in the greater majority, saudis aren't rushing to  be "liberated" by mixing with the other gender.


If they are drinking Alcohol then  you may have to take out your fine tooth-comb to find them. no denial that it exists, however, thinking that you're going to find SAUDIs as a nation of drunks,  you're better off believing in santa.

there has yet to come an official explanation on why the liberals want to move to a  conservative country and then whine about its ways. since you're already living in a liberal place with a bunch of liberals then the only math that adds up here is that you stay with ya own kind.

rareshine wrote:

you're CERTAINLY confused because you're trying to apply your western "values" or lack thereof on a society that highly respects and regards people with morals. what you read is a bunch of western chatter on the internet about what saudis are, and mostly aren't. Since you decided to generalize a whole nation under liberals  based upon reading a few inadequately informed posts .. i'll try to help you out.

1. saudi government is adhering to the ONLY version of islam there is and that is the islam found in the Quran and the Sunnah of the Prophet Muhammad salAllaahu alayhi wa salaam. there weren't versions of islaam revealed nor practiced, so to call it an interpretation of something  is a false pretense.

The government, is only a mirror image of its people, (check your history books) therefore, the saudis are religious and fundamental in more than one aspect. Gender-mixed ANYTHING doesn't exist anywhere except on western compounds or other nonpublic places. if you mean that women mix with their fathers, brothers, uncles and family member then you're on target.  but in the greater majority, saudis aren't rushing to  be "liberated" by mixing with the other gender.


If they are drinking Alcohol then  you may have to take out your fine tooth-comb to find them. no denial that it exists, however, thinking that you're going to find SAUDIs as a nation of drunks,  you're better off believing in santa.

there has yet to come an official explanation on why the liberals want to move to a  conservative country and then whine about its ways. since you're already living in a liberal place with a bunch of liberals then the only math that adds up here is that you stay with ya own kind.

Alright, thanks for the answer. This is a subject I'm still quite ignorant about so sorry if i offended you, that wasn't my intention.

But yeah, I was kind of expecting that this would be the case, thanks for replying!

not at all

Never the truth , bikini where? yes alkhobar is a little liberal beach with no abaya but not a bikini.
dont discuss alcohol here , its haram ( forbidden ) you will get into trouble.
Women will NEVER BE EQUAL TO MEN IN THE ARAB WORLD !
Stick to the 10 comandments , practice what is preached not done
Trust me i am a womanwho lived there. Do your business and get out.

Not every place can be the same. Otherwise the world would be monotonous and colorless. You travel to different countries, explore, observe, gel in and move to another. Respect everyones religion, culture, social norms and language. Life has less miseries that way.

rareshine wrote:

you're CERTAINLY confused because you're trying to apply your western "values" or lack thereof on a society that highly respects and regards people with morals. what you read is a bunch of western chatter on the internet about what saudis are, and mostly aren't. Since you decided to generalize a whole nation under liberals  based upon reading a few inadequately informed posts .. i'll try to help you out.

1. saudi government is adhering to the ONLY version of islam there is and that is the islam found in the Quran and the Sunnah of the Prophet Muhammad salAllaahu alayhi wa salaam. there weren't versions of islaam revealed nor practiced, so to call it an interpretation of something  is a false pretense.

The government, is only a mirror image of its people, (check your history books) therefore, the saudis are religious and fundamental in more than one aspect. Gender-mixed ANYTHING doesn't exist anywhere except on western compounds or other nonpublic places. if you mean that women mix with their fathers, brothers, uncles and family member then you're on target.  but in the greater majority, saudis aren't rushing to  be "liberated" by mixing with the other gender.


If they are drinking Alcohol then  you may have to take out your fine tooth-comb to find them. no denial that it exists, however, thinking that you're going to find SAUDIs as a nation of drunks,  you're better off believing in santa.

there has yet to come an official explanation on why the liberals want to move to a  conservative country and then whine about its ways. since you're already living in a liberal place with a bunch of liberals then the only math that adds up here is that you stay with ya own kind.

There is ONE version of Islam however the hadiths can have different interpretations and thus we have different school of thoughts. This is a reality whether you admit or not. And to be able to tolerate everyone's belief and to be able to live peacefully with everyone's faith is the only way forward to make our lives any more miserable than they are.

women will never be equal to men in ANY WORLD. period. and never understood why people believe that to be true. I lived in the states for 20 years and inequality was always present. women, no matter how educated, never got paid like a man did in that same position, especially when it comes to business. (the glass ceiling) - the feminism movement came exactly from that lack of economic and social rights ie. equality.

anyway, i dont understand why women exhaust themselves trying to be like men. i'm a woman and I want to fulfill my roles and not the mans roles. we are equal in that we have equal responsibility to family and society but for me to chase after the man's role is stupid - and makes zero sense. we have equality in the difference of roles and a man cannot fulfill my role (child bearing, suckling) etc. so why would I chase to fulfill his body strength (at work) and try to compete with him in the field where he clearly dominates.

faymoyo1 wrote:

Never the truth , bikini where? yes alkhobar is a little liberal beach with no abaya but not a bikini.
dont discuss alcohol here , its haram ( forbidden ) you will get into trouble.
Women will NEVER BE EQUAL TO MEN IN THE ARAB WORLD !
Stick to the 10 comandments , practice what is preached not done
Trust me i am a womanwho lived there. Do your business and get out.

live.ali wrote:

rareshine wrote:

you're CERTAINLY confused because you're trying to apply your western "values" or lack thereof on a society that highly respects and regards people with morals. what you read is a bunch of western chatter on the internet about what saudis are, and mostly aren't. Since you decided to generalize a whole nation under liberals  based upon reading a few inadequately informed posts .. i'll try to help you out.

1. saudi government is adhering to the ONLY version of islam there is and that is the islam found in the Quran and the Sunnah of the Prophet Muhammad salAllaahu alayhi wa salaam. there weren't versions of islaam revealed nor practiced, so to call it an interpretation of something  is a false pretense.

The government, is only a mirror image of its people, (check your history books) therefore, the saudis are religious and fundamental in more than one aspect. Gender-mixed ANYTHING doesn't exist anywhere except on western compounds or other nonpublic places. if you mean that women mix with their fathers, brothers, uncles and family member then you're on target.  but in the greater majority, saudis aren't rushing to  be "liberated" by mixing with the other gender.


If they are drinking Alcohol then  you may have to take out your fine tooth-comb to find them. no denial that it exists, however, thinking that you're going to find SAUDIs as a nation of drunks,  you're better off believing in santa.

there has yet to come an official explanation on why the liberals want to move to a  conservative country and then whine about its ways. since you're already living in a liberal place with a bunch of liberals then the only math that adds up here is that you stay with ya own kind.

There is ONE version of Islam however the hadiths can have different interpretations and thus we have different school of thoughts. This is a reality whether you admit or not. And to be able to tolerate everyone's belief and to be able to live peacefully with everyone's faith is the only way forward to make our lives any more miserable than they are.

*correction*  : any less miserable*

It's tough being here, and most people are here for financial reasons. Slow changes are occurring, but there is no Saudi social life. Foreigners have to create artificial social environments. Of course, there are some masochists who like dealing with this difficult life style.

Here is the text of another post for you to consider:
"This has probably been asked many times, but circumstances change all the time and I have heard that the Muttawa have been checking marriage certificates more and more lately. Question is, I have a girlfriend that I love dearly, however we are too afraid to go out and do things in the city because of all the horror stories we have heard about being out in public with a member of the opposite sex, and we are getting very bored. We hardly get to see each other, and if I want to visit her at her compound, I have to get a male on the compound to sign me in, as she is not allowed to sign men on. The married ladies have no problem signing their husband in on the compound.

Please can you guys give advice or personal stories on:
1) walking around malls / going to restaurants / staying in hotels / driving in the city with your partner: is it advisable, will I be approached?
2) are there any ways to get around this problem we are afraid of. For example will being engaged help?"

Thinks about that lad's dilemma for a reality check. I have been out with a western lady friend (just platonic), and apart from restaurants, there is NOWHERE TO GO. No cinemas, no theatre, no clubs, no pubs or bars, nothing. Most coffe bars are men only, by default. Plus the irritation of the lady being frequently stopped and told to cover her hair.

If you like lots of expensive shopping, with odd closing times, come to Saudi. If you want anything else, stay away.

Perfect answers lady. I am your fan. 

Hahaha it's funny actually the prt you mention about the Muttawa, well yeah it's kinda strict but lately they become less strict it's okay don't feel afraid cuz if you get caught they won't do a shit for you tgey just gonna tell you we are going to call her parents cuz you know the Saudi Culture and all that stuff about girls. Anyway, don't be too afraid just feel free to hangout with her much more often. I totally agree with you at that point you got no place to go with her but buddy the system of dating here is your house or her house to spend time and you can go out to the Malls such as Redsea mall and al Tahlia street + Al Khalidia street are full of and cafes restaurants "you will like it cuz it's good for dating. Behind al Tahlia street there is a place to walk full of people who are busy by doing there shit and as i told you, don't be afraid buddy just go with her and if they stop you ! Be confident when you talk to them and they will leave you alone. actually there's a smart way to deal with them but i've talking too much so later I'll explain it for you. Good luck

Westerners are not devoid of Morals. Beyond that. You are living in a society that has deep religious root in Islam. For you to come here and ask how to go about getting around the teachings here is disgraceful.  I have been here 5 years and I would never think it was my duty or just OK to go against society.
You are supposed to assimilate not the other way around.
If you can't respect the country go back home. Your not supposed to be dating, that is not the way of this country. Grow up.

I grew up in Jeddah i'm a part of this society i know a lot

I'll try and give you a factual  answer without the invective.

Most of what you have been told is somewhat exaggerated. It's true that in the Eastern province and in e.g. Jeddah things are a little more relaxed. Western women do wear abayas in Jeddah but don't wear headscarves. There are private beaches run by places like the Sheraton that allow swimwear (not on public ones though). When I first moved here an old hand pointed out to me that in a place where things are prohibited a black market starts and this also true. It doesn't mean that the country is indistinguishable from the West. It's important to respect local customs and successful living here means doing that. Hope that helps...