Real Estate Black List

You're right, it's a sensitive topic, but I would like to understand "the facts" that makes you think Las Olas should be on your black list?

Our personal experience with Las Olas has been, up to now, a very positive one.  Despite all gossips, I'm personally very happy with the way things are going.  Every other owners with whom I had the privilege to talk to also have a similar opinion.  Are we blindfolded?  Maybe.

At the same time, observers only have the outside pictures.  There is a private group on Facebook where only owners can access, discuss, share some thoughts and where we are regularly updated by the developers.  Owners part of the Founders Club are also deeply involved in different areas (golf course, nature trails planning, rules and regulations, etc.).  I think they are doing it on purpose because they want the first owners to be truly believers and not only investors.  They say they want to develop a community of people sharing the same mind/vision and that's what I'm witnessing.

I feel confident and secure about our investment because all negative things I've heard up to now about Las Olas are from people who either never met with the promoters, never visited the whole property and are just reporting the latest rumor from the village (or seem to have another agenda).

When I went to Las Olas, there was a delegation of the ministry of environment (or the similar in Ecuador) + plus other local executives from the city and the county who came to visit the property.  Honestly, if they were doing something wrong, someone would have pulled the alarm.  David Maksymuik was also invited by the President and Minister of tourism to showcase the Las Olas project during a private meeting with other investors.  Between you and I, you don't invite a fraudster or someone doing something illegal (still, I'm not saying it's impossible).

My lawyer told me that: "dated May 8 of the year two thousand fourteen, during the session of the Council of THE GOBIERNO AUTÓNOMO DESCENTRALIZADO OF THE CANTÓN SUCRE, has approved the project of urbanization "LAS OLAS".".  Well, I'm saying my lawyer, but seems that someone verified and he never was my lawyer and he never work for anyone regarding Las Olas! 

There's only one way to do things and it's to do your own due diligence.  I haven't done proper research on any other project in Ecuador, as Las Olas was the only one fulfilling our list of criteria.

What criteria should make a project being on a black list?

Yulrun, when I attempted to access the public beach in front of Las Olas security stopped me. They do not want anyone seeing what is happening there without the owners present. As I stated, I am wary of Las Olas. I think at best it is simply crazily over priced. At worst it will never be completed. What is most likely, is something in between. Over priced luxury homes in an isolated half deserted community. This is my opinion. I have never spoken to the owners or promoters and I have no interest is this particular type of real estate. My opinion is based primarily on my experience with Ecuadorian land and home values and the reality of what these luxury retirement communities look like 5 or 10 years after completion. The place might sell out and be fully built, but as the shine fades, soon 80% of the houses will be vacant or only seasonally occupied. People will fail to maintain their homes and fail to pay the maintenance fees for the public areas. the value simply does not justify the price.

Fair enough Jessekimerling, but I was expecting you to come up with "facts" against Las Olas, not your personal subjective impression.

Remember it's a construction site, so I think that's the main reason why they do not allow people to go on site.  If you want to sneak in, take the road that goes from the highway to the beach.  That will allow you to see what is going on without "crossing the border". 

That said, I agree with you that this type of place is not to everyone's liking.

For the price I'm paying, I probably could get a very nice house on a 10 acres land elsewhere in Ecuador.  In Panama, I would only have a 2-bedroom condo in a huge tower and in Mauritius where I live, well, absolutely nothing!  Foreigners can only buy property worth over $500k.  So yes, there's different projects for different people.

I'm a golfer, my wife is a golfer, my both kids are golfers, my parents are golfers... and buying a property under $150k with a membership in a world-class golf course, while having access to a beach club, a tennis club, an equestrian center, etc. that's simply a non-sense.  You think it's too much money, I think it's an unbelievable deal.  And luxury is also quite subjective.  For me, there's nothing luxurious at Las Olas.

These are, in my opinion, luxurious projects (nothing below $2,5M):
http://www.minthishills.com/http://www.anahitaproperty.com/http://www.diamantecabosanlucas.com/http://boavista.com.br/index.php/en/

Here, I live 10 min away from this place http://www.tamarina.mu/.  This is where I play golf every week.  In 2006, pre-construction deal for the first few houses was $500k, which is the minimum price for a foreigner to buy here in Mauritius.  At that time, it was the first real estate project for foreigners and everybody was finding that completely crazy, too expensive! Today, none of these houses is selling for less than $2,2M.  Moreover, there's now 10 projects like that all over the island.  Is it overpriced?  Yes it is, big time... but we are far from Las Olas here price list here!

So I would love someone to come out and tell me Las Olas should be on the black list for objective reasons and show us the proof they are stealing money, or they are squatting a land they don't own, or they don't have authorization, or whatever valid and legal reason.  You said someone in Cotacatchi owes you $10k since 2 years, that's a valid reason to be careful!  On this blog you can find people saying that they invested at Las Olas, changed their mind and got their money back.  Who was fooled?

I can understand why you are so defensive when people mention their concerns about Las Olas. I would be too if I had invested in the project.

I would like to remind you, I simply stated that I was wary of the Las Olas project, and only detailed my concerns and suspicions when you asked me to. No, I have no facts. Yes, I drove down the public road to the beach that runs along the south side of the project. Security stopped me from accessing the public beach in front of the project.

Well, when they will screw me, I'll be the first to talk against them don't worry!

Like I said, I respect your opinion, but I don't think you blacklist a project base on an opinion.

If you think there's not 1,500 people on earth willing to live in Las Olas, fine.  Personnally, I have no clue why people live in 40 floor towers in Panama City.  I just don't get it, but they are building more of them...

I visited Montecristi and didn't like it.  Should it be blacklisted? No... Unless someone knows they are not honest or legal.  I thought that was the purpose of your thread.

Remax in Cotacatchi is on my black list. Again, I simply stated that I am wary of Las Olas. I stated only facts. I stated that I am wary. I stated that I have no interest in the project and haven't spoken to the owners or promoters. I stated that I was prevented from accessing the public beach. Only when you asked me to, did I offer my opinions.

I believe (and again, this is just my opinion) you based your belief that Las Olas is priced reasonably by comparing this project in Ecuador to the prices you experienced in Mauritius and perhaps other expensive locations.

I can buy a beachfront lot in Ecuador from between 5k to 50k depending on the quality of the area, and I can build a simple house for about 20k, or a luxury home for about 60k. This is why I believe Las Olas is over priced. Again, just my opinion, but I feel that such excessive pricing is exploitive and dishonest. But then, I'm not a golfer and I'm not retired, so perhaps I simply don't understand the value of golf and gated communities.

I tend to agree with yulrun, you should not blacklist a project based on the fact that they would not let you on their construction site unattended. If that is the blacklist criteria that we should blacklist every project that abides by the law.

You put them on your new blacklist tread without even giving them the courtesy of a visit when you were there which I personally think is poor.

As for price, I do not think you are comparing apples to apples. I do not think you can find another beachfront project in Ecuador or anywhere else for that matter that offers the amenities of Las Olas, amazing ocean views and a golf course of the quality that I envision Las Olas's course to be.

I posted on another thread that I met Jerry Pierman while on my last visit.

Below is what I said:   
“I just made my second trip to Ecuador and Las Olas. I was there in October of last year. I was amazed at how much more work was completed since my last visit. The whole back community which you do not see from the ocean has been graded and the golf course holes have all been shaped in that area and look absolutely amazing. The ocean front area of the property continues to be shaped in preparation for home construction. I amazes me how Las Olas came up with a unique and revolutionary design to allow so many homes to have ocean views.

I was also fortunate enough to meet both partners Randy Russ and David Maksymuik while I was there. Both are very impressive. What was equally if not more impressive was my opportunity to talk with Jerry Pierman. Mr. Pierman was invited down to Las Olas to take a look at their golf course Ciebo Valley. Jerry is one of the foremost experts in golf course construction in the world. He worked for over ten years with Jack Nicklaus, half as a Vice President of Golden Bear. He has been a manager of both Tom Fazio's and of Pete Dye's Golf design companies. He has constructed over 23 courses for designers like Jack Nicklaus, Jim Fazio, Art Hills and others and remodel several more. He has traveled all over the world looking at resort properties and golf course locations. Jerry was formerly the President of the Golf Course Builders Association and sat on the Advisory Board for the World Golf Hall of Fame. In addition to building Muirfield Village Golf Course for Jack Nicklaus he was its first General Manager and served on the Executive Committee for Jack Nicklaus's PGA tour Memorial Golf Tournament.

So apparently no one could argue that he is more than qualified to assess Las Olas and Ciebo Valley Golf Course. What he said to me was that it was the most incredible site and layout for a golf course and development that he has ever seen. He thought the routing for the golf course, the beauty of the ocean and surrounding mountains was simple spectacular. He said their use of the property and innovated design was remarkable. Randy and David are true visionaries. I was very captivated by Jerry's insights and he obviously is very qualified to make that determination.”

Now this is a gentleman that really is qualified and knows what he is talking about as he has seen projects all over the world.

I have been looking at pricing of homes around Ecuador and I do not find Las Olas prices exploitive or dishonest. In fact, I find them way underpriced when you compare them to projects of similar nature anywhere in the world. Montecristi in Ecuador has similar prices for lots and they don't even have ocean views. I also question your cost to build a home. The prices I received to construct a home were at least as expensive as Las Olas.  I have talked to individuals that built their own homes. Sure you can get a home that is small with poor workmanship for cheap. Good luck to you. But the individuals I talked to that built their own homes in the past couple of years, said the price came in much higher than promised, they had lots of problems and they would not do it again.

Again, I simply stated that I was wary of the Las Olas project. If you want to interpret that as black listing the project that's up to you.

Sorry, but I believe you said, and I quote "just my opinion, but I feel that such excessive pricing is exploitive and dishonest."

Does the price of construction you considered have appliances included? Does the price include a completely finished outdoor kitchen. Does the price include high-end window coverings? Does the price include the highest quality PVC windows?

Does the community that you priced have one of the best golf courses in South America, does it have a Equestrian Center, does it have a tennis club, does it have a beach club and spa, does it have a 650 acre nature reserve complete with walking, biking and horseback riding trails. Is it a secure and protected community? Does the lot have a ocean view? Is it a short distance from one of the nicest resort communities in Ecuador?

I think you get the picture, you did not do any real investigation and yet you started a blog called Real Estate Black List and said you are wary of Las Olas. Then you went on to say that and I quote "just my opinion, but I feel that such excessive pricing is exploitive and dishonest."

With all respect I think you are being exploitive and dishonest or at the very least unreliable.

Ok, Peter, enjoy your very expensive house. I see I've touched a nerve by daring to say I'm wary of this project. I doubt that you would be so defensive if you were truly confident in the project. To me, you sound like someone who is trying to convince themself that they haven't made a big mistake.

A black List Warning- any developer in a foreign country asking for a very high market value for a lot on a vision without completed infrastructure such as electrical and water to each serviced lot as part of the urbanization permits. The real red flag should be your hard earn $$$$ being asked for in advance for building your home, whether in full or installments held in some type of escrow whether in or out of country.

To be honest, all builders should have building contracts where each phase of construction requires a draw of funds. Before you move to the next phase of completion, all work should be inspected to ensure it meets the standards in the contract. When completed their is a sign off and warranty work if required.

Remember, you are in a foreign country without the quality of inspection or rules seen in North America. BUYER BEWARE and all the best with your hard earned $$$$$$ saved for most~ in retirement.

Jesse:

It looks like when you're discussing things with the super-sensitive Las Olas crowd, you need to do things like put 'wary of' in bold and italic.

No Bob...

I don't think it was the super sensitive Las Olas crowd the got PeterWMass's back up I think it was the use of the words exploitive and dishonest by Jesse without doing any really investigation. Do you think that is appropriate?

LindaB10 wrote:

No Bob...

I don't think it was the super sensitive Las Olas crowd the got PeterWMass's back up I think it was the use of the words exploitive and dishonest by Jesse without doing any really investigation. Do you think that is appropriate?

If a car salesman tries to sell me a 95 Ford 150 with 200k miles for 8k I walk away thinking "that was exploitive and dishonest." If a real estate developer attempts the equivalent I don't feel the need to do a lot of research into whatever delusions have caused other people to feel such a price is justified. The fact that you'all are reacting to my opinion like it is some kind of person attack is strange at best. I am beginning to suspect that it might be true that the promoters or owners are posing as happy customers to promote their project.

Linda: Re 'supersensitive':

Comment #1: "I am also very wary of the Las Olas and Engabow/Playas projects"
Comment #3: "As I stated, I am wary of Las Olas. I think at best it is simply crazily over priced. At worst it will never be completed. What is most likely, is something in between."
Comment #5: "I would like to remind you, I simply stated that I was wary of the Las Olas project, and only detailed my concerns and suspicions when you asked me to."
Comment #7: "Again, I simply stated that I am wary of Las Olas."
Comment #9: "Again, I simply stated that I was wary of the Las Olas project. If you want to interpret that as black listing the project that's up to you."

Don't think anyone will accuse me of being a spokesman for Las Olas. Have probably always been a more of a critic than proponent. As a non emotional observer, think both sides have to be realistic. If Las Olas accomplishes what they are promoting, then those that have bought/invested will have gotten there moneys worth (in my opinion). If things stall out, or winds up only being a fraction of what is being promised, then the people who have bought/invested probably have gotten very little for the asking cost, and will be sitting on a losing investment.

That's kind of what an investment/speculation is all about. You do your research, and investigating, and decide if it's worth the risk, or not. Think opponents of this project have to be realistic in the fact that if it does wind up being completed as is currently proposed, then those that made the choice to buy have made a wise decision. The opposite is also true. Proponents have to be realistic in the fact that if things don't develop as planned, then they are probably sitting on a loser.

j600rr: Your view is not far from my own (which I have stated before). Las Olas gives off a "too good to be true" vibe, which causes my BS deflectors to activate, but that is often true of yet-to-be-built land developments.

The only advice I have ever offered to Las Olas prospects is along the lines of be wary (if I may use that phrase). I would offer the same advice to folks considering a highly-touted but still-on-the-drawing-board development in the US or anywhere else (well, actually, there is the added risk of buying land in a country where you may not be familiar with the legal system, but that's a whole nother matter).

I strongly agree with you that only time is going to tell whether Las Olas turns out to be what its developers say it will be.

I agree with BobH and j600rr comments.

Las Olas is a risky investment, that's for sure. No one should put his hardly earned money without doing proper research and analyze and evaluate his own level of comfort with the risks involved (in Las Olas or in any other project whatsoever).

Now starting a thread with the subject line "Real Estate Black List" and mentioning Las Olas as a potential member of the above mentioned black list, when your only knowledge about the project is what you read online and what you saw from the beach, is a little bit cowboy IMHO.  It's also, I have to admit, very offensive to people who spent hours and hours doing their homework and flew from abroad to visit (in my case, 4 flights totalling 28 hours in a plane!).

Again, I'm not saying Las Olas will be a success and I'm not saying people who thinks it will fail doesn't have the right to say so.  I'm just saying that Las Olas shouldn't be mentioned aside of REMAX Cotacatchi who owe jessekimmerling $10k, especially when the thread mentions "facts only".

As PeterWMass mentioned, have at least the decency to pay a visit to Las Olas sales office to at least understand what they are selling.  Trust me you won't feel you're in front of a Remax agent...

I would love it if we could either return to the much broader original topic, or just let the thread die. I had no idea that saying "I'm wary of the Las Olas project," was going to stir up such a hornets nest.

I know it's a lot to ask, moving on from the big argument, but it's not interesting or informative.

Jesse, since you seem to be living around Bahia, there is  another development, called Playa Canoa Club, you  need to be very wary about, too.
You might know already about it, as it is located near Las Olas.
I did as much facts searching on it as you did on Las Olas and found out that it is much more expensive than Las Olas with no amenities but a pool.
To be honest, I have never visit the site but Aggie Carter, who is the administrator for the Northern Manabi Coastal Expats on Facebook informed me about it. She actually lives in Bahia .She really wanted to buy into that project, but after doing her due diligence  she decided against investing in Playa Canoa Club.

I don't know what changed her mind, but as she seems to be a respected person, who has been living in Bahia for a few years,she must have access to  better information than I can find on the internet.

I am sure she doesn't mind if you want to contact her about it
and than you can decided if you want to blacklist  Playa Canoa Club.

Yulrun,

Please read my response. Is there anything you don't agree with? If, Las Olas or any other developer is asking for money up front in building a home at some point in time without a firm and binding signed building contract with monetary consequences, run for the hills! No due diligence researching will justify that scenario and MAXIMUM RISK! That is why these type of developers deserve to be placed here on the highest watch list.
Sorry for that but reality needs to set in and ensure you all can get the developer to at least provide the necessities of infrastructure to each lot ASAP. Who cares about a golf course when owners can't build and use their lots as the requirements of the urbanization permits NOW. How much more time needs to pass before something smell foul? If the developer is honest, he will understand and correct immediately for all those people waiting for their dream homes in the Bahia area now. It may be time for all the owners to stand united.............................to get concrete timelines from the developer in writing as an official contract registered within the municipio? Does your personal contract, not escritura have timelines for completion  of infrastructure, both water and electric? If not, ask why not........! My guess, he is leveraging all this expense (the highest expense) on attracting new lot and future home owners funding this portions of the project as he moves along. "Just in time" development is not a way to develop your "good will" as a developer and exposing the lot owners to the greatest risks possible.
All the BEST

Hello Doglargo,

Of course I will read your comment, but not sure I understand the meaning.

Do you think Las Olas owners are a bunch of stupid jerks who gave a cheque to the first salesperson trying to sell them  the moon?

Come on!  Have you ever contacted the people of Las Olas?  Have you met with them? Have you ever seen all the paperwork, permits, authorizations they have?  Have you ever hired a lawyer to double-check everything?  Do you know what kind of contract I signed?  Do you know how much money I paid?  Do you know what I'm getting for what I paid? Do you have an idea of each parties responsabities and guarantees?

IMHO, Las Olas is doing things "by the book".  The owners are kept aware of the development, I'm not aware of anyone worry about their investment and we are all happy and in peace with the move we did. 

That's not a Ponzi scheme don't worry... I'm maybe wrong and if I'm wrong, well I won't regret it one second because I really did my homework.

Stop reading stupid comments from people giving their opinions without any real knowledge.  Get in touch with Las Olas and ask a lawyer to double-check. 

If you are still worry after that, then run away, come here and explain why.

A hired Ecuadorian lawyer checking what? Permits, and the rest should be a given and somewhat inexpensive for the developer. However, did they not caution you and other owners on giving extra monies to be held in so called escrow accounts without true legitimate safeguards. The question that needs to be asked, why would any developer require this type of payment in advance of building homes when infrastructure is not even completed?

Sometimes pure emotions just gets the best of US. I truly hope your right, please let us know in a year or two on the process to everyone expectations and guarantees.

I'm sure it will all work out.....

Doglargo wrote:

please let us know in a year or two on the process to everyone expectations and guarantees.

I'm sure it will all work out.....

we expect a report in April, 2015, next month, as to whether or not the housing construction has commenced.

mugtech wrote:

Doglargo wrote:

please let us know in a year or two on the process to everyone expectations and guarantees.

I'm sure it will all work out.....

we expect a report in April, 2015, next month, as to whether or not the housing construction has commenced.

Mugtech,

Excellent, keep the pressure on and ask the questions that need to be asked and have them in writing. Remember, when the municipio granted the permits for "urbanization" in developing the land, there are requirements for serviced lots. However, if not stressed, there may be no timeframes for completion and time is on the developers side to gain more wealth from dirt roads and dream sales with promises.

All the best!

Sorry, but this thread is for black listed project.  How can you talk about something you don't know?

Mugtech, don't expect house construction to begin next month. All owners know it won't happen.  We know why and from my perspective, that doesn't prevented me to invest.

A project should be judged by people who have money at risk, not by observers who found their opinion on what they read on Internet.  I can understand that you want to warn people, which is fine, but stop thinking people have no brain and give money away without getting anything in return.

mugtech wrote:

we expect a report in April, 2015, next month, as to whether or not the housing construction has commenced.

I had forgotten about that Mug. I went back and looked and a post dated 14 Nov 2014 said:

As of today "Home construction commencing in six months"
http://lasolasecuador.com/master-plan/

So I hit the link, and guess what that page says now? "Home construction commencing in six months".

Hmmmm.

Evidently 6months = Manana

yulrun wrote:

Sorry, but this thread is for black listed project.  How can you talk about something you don't know?

Mugtech, don't expect house construction to begin next month. All owners know it won't happen.  We know why and from my perspective, that doesn't prevented me to invest.

A project should be judged by people who have money at risk, not by observers who found their opinion on what they read on Internet.  I can understand that you want to warn people, which is fine, but stop thinking people have no brain and give money away without getting anything in return.

What do I care how you spend your money?  If someone says something will happen in 6 months and then 6 months later it does not happen, does that alter your opinion of the reliability of said person?  If not, why not?

I get your point Mugtech, but owners are updated frequently. They see and know what is going on.  I visited Las Olas in November and since then, I've been in touch either with the promoters, employees or other owners every week or two.  That's why I don't understand all the fuzz going around and also why you don't hear about anyone having money at the table complaining. 

If I would be kept in the dark, I would be scared.  I'm not scared at all.  My wife even wants us to buy another condo...

What's the point of following a project you have no interest in?  Laugh about people who failed? Don't worry, I won't be either crying or laughing whatever the end result is.  For me, it's just a normal day at the office.

If Las Olas don't want to share updated images regularly, that's their strategy.  I assume they prefer start marketing the project once it will be at a more advance stage of completion (infrastructure completed, golf course, etc.) which will just drive prices higher.  I also presume the positive reactions they received from people who do visit is confirming their strategy.  They are not in a rush and they are not looking after cash, but you don't have to trust me.  If you contact them to inquire about a condo/house, you'll have the other side of the medal. Otherwise, want observers are saying here is pure speculation.

That's the point, of this post, you may not care what happens to your hard earned money, other's unsuspecting buyers may and should, that is why most are investing in Ecuador. I may not know of the developers of Las Olas, but from their business model, I have seen their peers for years here at work. With this type of business model most fail and/or greatly underperform as promised with little or no recourse. This is not my first rodeo in Central or South America and do own property in Manabí, have an escritura and pay property taxes.

Developers and or their agents can tell you whatever you what to hear, owners just need to see the signs that make you say "wait a minute" at some point. Separate the emotion and seek the facts put in writing within a contract and registered within the municipio under the urbanization permit with clear timeframes for completion!. Did your lawyers advise you of this?
This thread is really meant to those who are seeking a new future home and/or building lot to live their DREAM in retirement within beautiful Ecuador. The perfect honest scenario would be, a partial payment for a high priced lot on a vision of excellence, with installments as infrastructure and roads are completed. The final installment would only be after each building lot is totally finished as the lot is totally services to build and live on at that point in time. Thereafter, comes the building contracts with payment on installments as work has been completed. Anything less, is a true WARNING.... and other investors should not walk away but RUN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Unless you are a speculator, just like playing the high risk penny stocks in the stock markets,  your money is treated as fun money that you are totally willing to loss. If this is the case, you should be demanding a high discount in pricing for your RISK in the deal, not the other way around! No research and/or analysis will increase your odds in these scenario's in advancing all or most of your money to a developer on a promise and dream of that "vision of grandeur"! They need to be able to self fun the completion of roads and infrastructure first, complete that phase and then sell the high priced lots that can be immediately built on and be livable. The little extra in finishing touches can come later in phases.

This is not Kansas .....................as Dorothy says!!!!!!!! BUYER BEWARE....................

Doglargo wrote:

That's the point, of this post, you may not care what happens to your hard earned money, other's unsuspecting buyers may and should, that is why most are investing in Ecuador. I may not know of the developers of Las Olas, but from their business model, I have seen their peers for years here at work. With this type of business model most fail and/or greatly underperform as promised with little or no recourse. This is not my first rodeo in Central or South America and do own property in Manabí, have an escritura and pay property taxes.

Developers and or their agents can tell you whatever you what to hear, owners just need to see the signs that make you say "wait a minute" at some point. Separate the emotion and seek the facts put in writing within a contract and registered within the municipio under the urbanization permit with clear timeframes for completion!. Did your lawyers advise you of this?
This thread is really meant to those who are seeking a new future home and/or building lot to live their DREAM in retirement within beautiful Ecuador. The perfect honest scenario would be, a partial payment for a high priced lot on a vision of excellence, with installments as infrastructure and roads are completed. The final installment would only be after each building lot is totally finished as the lot is totally services to build and live on at that point in time. Thereafter, comes the building contracts with payment on installments as work has been completed. Anything less, is a true WARNING.... and other investors should not walk away but RUN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Unless you are a speculator, just like playing the high risk penny stocks in the stock markets,  your money is treated as fun money that you are totally willing to loss. If this is the case, you should be demanding a high discount in pricing for your RISK in the deal, not the other way around! No research and/or analysis will increase your odds in these scenario's in advancing all or most of your money to a developer on a promise and dream of that "vision of grandeur"! They need to be able to self fun the completion of roads and infrastructure first, complete that phase and then sell the high priced lots that can be immediately built on and be livable. The little extra in finishing touches can come later in phases.

This is not Kansas .....................as Dorothy says!!!!!!!! BUYER BEWARE....................

Welcome back livinginbahia.

Yulrun,

Please don't confuse me for someone else, many may think the same but I am just trying to make aware for the new potential buyers. If you comfortable in your decisions and are just sitting on the side waiting for great things..... perfect for you and others who may think the same way.

I'm just saying..... reduce risks read my previous posts here. I just hope this is not a multimillion $$$$ scam with players in place having it look like a great future development, land owners fronting all their money on the total risk. Moving dirt around is one thing but putting in the final infrastructure, underground water lines and electrical is totally another to have completed building lots ready for living there as per the required permits of urbanization!

Time will tell if the price paid with much of the risk is truly worth your style of investment, investigating and analysing data and requirements?

But, Bob, how do you feel?   

I don't think Bob is feeling good. However, the black list seems to be going around Bahia.

The sale of lots by the Vista Pacífica company has become problematic.

In a thread on the Ecuador forum that has been moderated and removed, Mrs. Larry Pioli disavowed responsibility for the actions of husband Larry and alleged that her name had been forged on deeds involved in the sale of the lots.

Eileen Paoli suggests that anyone with a deed since July 2013 that purports to show her signature should contact the registrar of deeds in Jama, Ecuador.

Posted by J600RR on another blog here on "Expat.com"........
Looks like Visa Pacifica may have been a scam from the beginning.

https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/coa … topics/421

Does this smell like Las Olas.................. and the moving of dirt and no infrastructure completion for building of homes? Let the present owners of lots and the future owners decide......................? Did the author PRCountry have true concerns back in 2012 and then fast forwarding to present in 2015!?

Here's the link again. Doglargo's link seems to go into something else, or at least it did when I clicked it.

https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/coa … topics/421

Sounds like the project started in 2009, and the original poster posted in September 2012, with other posts going into 2013. Have no real desire to research what is happening in any great detail, but with the other thread about Larry Pioli coming up decided to do a quick search. Not sure what exactly is happening, but to me it looks like the whole project was a scam from the beginning.