Robbed of Big Bucks in Broad Daylight After Leaving a Quito Bank!

cccmedia wrote:

Today on the "Roommates" thread, J** K. told us that his wife was robbed in Quito in 2014.

"Someone followed her from the bank after she made a large withdrawal and robbed her in broad daylight," he reported.

This is not the first recounting of such an incident.  I've heard from other Expats stories of gang member(s) on motorcycle grabbing purses and wallets filled with cash, from folks who had just made a big withdrawal.  Possibly, an accomplice inside the bank texted or called the "ladron" on the outside before the heist.

Which brings up some questions for possible discussion here....

What do the K** do differently now to avoid a repeat of that incident....

How can EC Expats protect themselves if leaving the bank with cash....

cccmedia in Quito

cccmedia, your behavior is a little strange. You took a comment I made about feeling generally safe in Quito despite a couple negative incidents out of context. **

Some times bad things happen. That is just part of life. Yes there are little things you can do to make yourself safer and reduce your risk, but obsessing over crime, exaggerating the risks, or missing out on life because you're afraid everyone and everything is no way to live. As I said in the post you took my comment from, to me, Quito feels safe. (Moderated: inappropriate) focus on something real, like traffic safety.
**

**Crime issues are NOT the same here as in the U.S. cities you mentioned.  There is more theft per capita in Gringo-rich areas here, even though a lot of it goes unreported, as it usually involves no weapons and no injuries.  I was pick-pocketed twice on the Ecovia bus line in Quito just in the past two months.  I had ridden the New York City subway and NYC buses during 12 years living there and was never robbed.   It's widely known that police in Ecuador do not investigate thefts under $600 if no one is seriously injured.

"Focus on something real," you said, "like traffic safety."  Yes, we discuss that too, but you certainly know -- from your own family's experience -- that the issue of someone getting robbed leaving a bank is real too.

You said correctly that there are things people can do to reduce the likelihood of being victimized, but you don't seem to want to give us any examples.

Here are several I follow:

Don't withdraw more than a few hundred dollars cash at one time from any bank or ATM.  Such withdrawals make you a target, and subject you potentially to a large financial loss.

If you absolutely must pay someone a large amount, figure out a way to make payment that doesn't put you in the malditos' path coming out of a bank alone.

Avoid using ATM's outdoors, after dark or in unsecure places (no police or guards around, as an example).

Telling me that I am exaggerating the risks and obsessing over crime by starting this thread is just plain inaccurate.  That was not what I did, was not my intention.  The part about supposedly missing out on life due to being afraid of everything and everybody, I'm not even going to dignify.

Anyone whose scolding scares Expats from communicating on this thread has done them a disservice.

If this thread makes you uncomfortable, I suggest you don't re-visit here.  Free speech WILL be exercised on Expat.com Ecuador.

cccmedia in Quito

Hi everybody,

Just to inform you that i have removed some posts ( insults) from this topic.

Can we please discuss without animosity?
I remind you that Expat.com is a friendly website and we are all here as a great family to exchange information, to discuss about matters relating to expatriation and of course, helping each other.

Thank you

Priscilla

Well put.

Earlier, we considered three ways to avert the leaving-the-bank robbery scenario.

Here are three more concepts to limit risk:

1. Upon receiving your cash from the teller, find the best area in the bank to discreetly divide your cash.  You could put some in a front pocket, some in another pocket and some in a shirt pocket whose bulge could be hidden with a light jacket.

2. Although it's advisable to keep your credit and debit cards at home most of the time in Ecuadorian cities, I suggest you use your cards as much as possible for larger purchases.  That way you can carry less cash on you. (When a Quito hacker once got the number of a Visa debit card that I had used at an Internet café, my U.S.-based bank got the resulting phony charge -- about $500 -- reversed "muy pronto.")

3. Obtain a money-belt, secret inside pocket or other device to hide your money.  A "delincuente" on a "moto" wants to grab a single pocketbook and scram, not inspect inside your clothing for zipped-up hiding places while a bunch of witnesses look on and you cry out for help.

On that topic of #3, my worst experience with the Quito malditos occurred in Centro Historico about four years ago when I inadvertently wandered onto the infamous Loja Street at four in the afternoon.  Although I noticed my mistake, a four-man gang cornered me before I could exit the area.  They grabbed me, put me on the ground, and stole $55 from my pockets.  Then they rushed off in four different directions.  (No weapon was shown.)

Fortunately, the "pandilla" never discovered that I had an additional $500 hidden elsewhere on my person in a device underneath my clothing. 

cccmedia in Quito

Ah, slapped by the heavy one sided hand of the forum censors.

Ok, let's try this again. I posted in another thread that I find Quito generally safe despite a couple negative experiences. Cccmedia took part of that post out of context and created this thread trying to promote the opposite idea, the idea that Quito is very dangerous. It's one of a series of posts ccc has made about crime that I think paints an inaccurate picture. I find it disrespectful to take something I posted out of context in this way.

No matter how many posts he puts up claiming that the primary intent of this thread was to promote the idea that Quito is dangerous...no matter how many posts he has claiming that I twisted his post from another thread, those allegations are false.  The fact remains:

The purpose of this thread is to assist Expats in being safe in their EC environment.  Ergo, the six safety-and-security tips I have already shared on this thread.

Crime, in particular theft, exists here, and any city-dwelling Expat who is in denial about that puts his or her family's property in jeopardy.

I never had any intent to scare anyone about crime here, and have repeatedly over time pointed out that the large majority of the theft incidents here in Quito do not involve weapons.

Malditos have stolen from me -- or attempted to steal -- eight times, and the only time I got roughed up was that four-man gang near Loja Street, and even they were weaponless. 

Ipso facto, my perceived level of danger is not nearly high enough to scare me away from Quito.  The vast majority of Quitenos are peace-loving and helpful to Expats, and I believe that city and security improvements -- here in El Centro, in particular -- have tended to reduce theft overall in the past decade.

IMO, this all means we have to be vigilant here and know theft-avoidance strategies...while not being paranoid about danger.  Just like in many good cities.

The exceptions in Ecuador are Guayaquil and the Colombian-border zones, which are certainly dangerous and not recommended for Expats.  I've posted at least ten times in the last year-and-a-half that Guayaquil is dangerous, and not one poster has tried to contradict those posts.

cccmedia in Quito

The respectful thing to do would be to delete this thread and then if you must make a new thread that does not use my words and my family's experience taken out of context.

Going forward, consider the idea of not sharing your family's experiences if you get this perturbed about another poster mentioning them.

Stating a fact -- or even starting a new discussion that includes the fact (in this case that a robbery occurred) -- does not inherently mean that it is out of context.  This holds true no matter how much someone may disagree with the discussion's existence or how uncomfortable the discussion makes an individual feel.

The idea that a point-of-view expressed on another thread should be perfectly transferred to this thread is a matter of opinion, not of context.

Give this blog's readers some credit.  They can judge the context.



                                                                                           .

Speaking from experience of living in a country where this kind of robbery is so frequent and has turned into such and art form that it has even been given it's own name "saidinha do banco", there are a number of easy measures that you can take to reduce the risks of becoming a victim. (In São Paulo alone these robberies happen about 10 - 20 times per day)

1.  If at all possible avoid making large cash withdrawals at all. If you need a large amount of funds for a specific transaction you should consider paying the extra fee to receive those funds in the form of an administrative check (banker's check / cashier's check).

2.  Arrange in advance to have large withdrawals take place in private, request using the manager's office or perhaps the safe deposit box vault or other private area which may be available for that purpose. (Out of sight is out of mind)

3.  When you go to the bank, take along a plain envelope. When making withdrawals ask the teller to count out the money on her desk and not on top of the counter as they usually do. You should watch the count as it is being done so you don't need to confirm it in front of everybody else in the bank. Have the teller place the funds in the envelope after counting and hand it to you. (Again, out of sight out of mind)

4.  Be especially aware of anybody who is just hanging around in the bank, not actually conducting any kind of transactions, they may be the spotter for the gang members outside on a motorcycle. Pay particular attention to anybody using a cellular phone who seems to be hanging around. Report them to bank staff or security.

5.  Avoid using cash as much as possible to cut down the risk. Use your credit card and/or debit card where you can do so to reduce the need for withdrawals in the first place.

6.  If all else fails, don't resist or put up a fight to keep your money. Too many people here in Brazil end up on a gurney at the IML (Instituto Médico Legal) waiting their turn for autopsy when they try this. Nothing is worth more than your life.... give it up and hope for the best.

Cheers,
James      Expat-blog Experts Team

Superior post, James.  Your best ever on Expat.com Ecuador.

Thank you.

James wrote:

Speaking from experience of living in a country (Brazil) where this kind of robbery is so frequent and has turned into such an art form that it has even been given it's own name "saidinha do banco"...

Portuguese:  saidinha do banco

Spanish:       salida de banco

English:        exiting the bank


                                                                                  .
(wordreference.com)

I have seen signs at Banco Pichincha stating that free escorts by the police are available to those making large withdrawals. Hopefully the police don't rob you, however. 

Nards Barley wrote:

I have seen signs at Banco Pichincha stating that free escorts by the police are available to those making large withdrawals. Hopefully the police don't rob you, however. 

Well Nards, if it were here in Brazil that would be a suckers bet. The odds would be 50/50 that they would do just that!

James wrote:

Nards Barley wrote:

I have seen signs at Banco Pichincha stating that free escorts by the police are available to those making large withdrawals. Hopefully the police don't rob you, however. 

Well Nards, if it were here in Brazil that would be a suckers bet. The odds would be 50/50 that they would do just that!

I believe you.  I would imagine you discourage anyone from retiring in Brazil,,,,,,,,,,

No actually, I encourage it, and I give all kinds of tips on how to stay out of harm's way, avoid the bureaucratic nightmare, and make a successful adaptation to life here.

High crime scary country indeed, but when you take the common sense precautions that one should not to make yourself a victim anywhere in the world, it's rather a nice place to live, really.

Being a "hands on" kind of guy, I've even got a few dozen made in Brazil marriages under my belt, that probably would never have happened without my personal help. I actually have a mailbox that's almost unlimited, but have to clean it out frequently because of all the thankyou messages.... surprise, surprise.

Nards Barley wrote:

James wrote:

Nards Barley wrote:

I have seen signs at Banco Pichincha stating that free escorts by the police are available to those making large withdrawals. Hopefully the police don't rob you, however. 

Well Nards, if it were here in Brazil that would be a suckers bet. The odds would be 50/50 that they would do just that!

I believe you.  I would imagine you discourage anyone from retiring in Brazil,,,,,,,,,,

You just couldn't resist engaging in conversation with him could you, even if it was a jab.

SawMan wrote:

Nards Barley wrote:

James wrote:

Well Nards, if it were here in Brazil that would be a suckers bet. The odds would be 50/50 that they would do just that!

I believe you.  I would imagine you discourage anyone from retiring in Brazil,,,,,,,,,,

You just couldn't resist engaging in conversation with him could you, even if it was a jab.

Guilty as charged.

SawMan wrote:

You just couldn't resist engaging in conversation with him could you, even if it was a jab.

Well, perhaps everybody here is trying to bury the hatchet and get along a bit better. Who knows? I don't hold grudges and it certainly appears that a few others here don't either. Anyway, I'm willing to wait and see how it plays out.

At the end of the day, we're all supposed to be here for the same reasons, sharing information and advice and trying to help out our fellow expats.

You cna always ask for a cashiers check.  You can also deposit money directly from your account into someone elses account. This is how I bought my motor scooter. I just asked the dealer for the name of his bank and his cuenta.

I would never withdraw a large sum of money anywhere in Ecuador. That having been said, my friend whose purse was rifled on a crowded bus after withdrawing a large sum was informed by the investigating officer that you need only dial 911 and request an escort.
I just returned from a week in Quito and had no problems. I observed security at Banco Pichincha before withdrawing cash and always carried my wallet in my front pocket. I also never travel alone outside of Cuenca.

carlmiller1944 wrote:

I would never withdraw a large sum of money anywhere in Ecuador. That having been said, my friend whose purse was rifled on a crowded bus after withdrawing a large sum was informed by the investigating officer that you need only dial 911 and request an escort.
I just returned from a week in Quito and had no problems. I observed security at Banco Pichincha before withdrawing cash and always carried my wallet in my front pocket. I also never travel alone outside of Cuenca.

Very nice story, should be on the Happy Thread

Well,good to be back in Ecuador once again, Quito for a few days in any case before heading out for adventures.
Let me just say I learned a valuable lesson on my cab ride from the airport:when the cab driver asked if I had change for a $20 bill. So, being the trusting type, I handed over the 2 $10 bills. Only to find out later that the $20 bill was counterfeit...so, although not a huge loss, as others may have had, I am taking this experience as a lesson learned, just feeling a bit embarrassed (not embarazado) by my naivitee.
La Compania is still as magnificent, Marescal-s Artesanal is just as crazy and Quicentro is just as busy as I remember.
Oh, the other thing I remember is that the sun is pretty potent so, without a gorra, I received my first sunburn on my frente...

pensionado wrote:

Only to find out later that the $20 bill was counterfeit...

However, the taxista's $3-bills were real!

But, seriously:  a non-violent theft and a sunburn...welcome back to Quito as you left it, Pensionado.

cccmedia in Quito

pensionado wrote:

Well,good to be back in Ecuador once again, Quito for a few days in any case before heading out for adventures.
Let me just say I learned a valuable lesson on my cab ride from the airport:when the cab driver asked if I had change for a $20 bill. So, being the trusting type, I handed over the 2 $10 bills. Only to find out later that the $20 bill was counterfeit...so, although not a huge loss, as others may have had, I am taking this experience as a lesson learned, just feeling a bit embarrassed (not embarazado) by my naivitee.
La Compania is still as magnificent, Marescal-s Artesanal is just as crazy and Quicentro is just as busy as I remember.
Oh, the other thing I remember is that the sun is pretty potent so, without a gorra, I received my first sunburn on my frente...

So did you report the SOB?  If not, you are part of the problem.

It happened today on Quito's Ecovia Bus Line....

...where I've been pickpocketed three times in the past.

Waiting for a bus that didn't seem to be coming, I noticed that the platform at Galo Plaza "parada" was getting crowded...and realized that I hadn't followed my own advice to consolidate my cash into a single pants pocket and my shirt pocket, when riding public transport here.

As I moved some bills out of a pants pocket, two of them dropped to the platform -- $15 as it turned out.

A young woman holding an infant was the first to notice and caught my attention.

In a flash before I could bend down, a middle-aged man dressed incongruously in a nylon winter-type coat -- in 68 F. degree weather at 3 p.m. -- scooped up the cash, and obviously was not looking to return it to yours truly.

Before he could tuck it away, I calmly said, "No, senor, es miyo" (mine.)

Just as calmly, he said, "Es suyo," and handed me the money.

Then he just stood there, quietly waiting for his bus, as if he hadn't tried to pull off yet another non-violent Quito theft.

Sure, something like this could happen anywhere*, but it's business as usual on the old Ecovia bus line.

cccmedia in Quito

*In fact, I saw it happen on the casino floor three years ago at Sands Casino in Bethlehem, Pennsylvania, coming back from a break in my blackjack dealer's uniform.  Someone dropped a 50 on the floor, and in two seconds flat, a woman bent down and grabbed it (and kept it) before I could intervene.