Moving To Saigon & Have A Few Questions

Scotsman84 wrote:

What's a reasonable monthly budget for:

Cleaner-VND150,000/2
WiFi: Depends on speed - unlimited medium speed VND400,000
Local food: VND100,000 including a couple of coffees/day.

Accommodation:
Quan 1, 2, 7 for a 80 square metre about $430-500/month all utilities extra. Often includes pool, gym.
Lease: 12 months with 30 days early termination notice with penalty
Ease of leasing: Easy with 2 months deposit
High Foreigner areas: Quan 1, 2, 7

Miscellaneous
WiFi: All over - often hard to get WiFi free area. WiFi free in many places
Safety: Mostly very safe unless you go slumming in dubious bars
Leave laptop and phone: NO! Crime is usually one of opportunity - not planned.

Assume VND22,000 - USD$1

Thanks for the advice.

Surprised by the apartment rental costs. That's about double what I was paying in BKK and I was led to believe Saigon was cheaper for rent.

My place in BKK was far from luxurious but not a dump either. Central, close to transport links, not as big as 80 sqm but spacious enough, all mod cons, pool, gym, massage, restaurants etc on site.

The 12 month contract thing will be tricky as I wouldn't want to commit to somewhere for that long. 6 months max.

Is that pretty standard?

Thanks for the information!

Scotsman84 wrote:

Surprised by the apartment rental costs. That's about double what I was paying in BKK and I was led to believe Saigon was cheaper for rent. ...

The 12 month contract thing will be tricky as I wouldn't want to commit to somewhere for that long. 6 months max.

The 12-month can be broken, but it means that you usually forfeit 1 months rent. That's why it is in the contracts (this money covers the rental agents commission).

Look in Craigs List for an idea of what you will pay.

You can get far cheaper housing in Da Nang ($200 for a small house). Ho Chi Minh is VN's premier city and where most all of the action is (Ha Noi is a political centre)

Jaitch already answered almost of your queries 
Look for old, related threads in this forum to understand more about Vietnam, culture, people,etc.
If you don't intend to buy car/ motorbike, then I suggest you stay near Q.1
It's convenient for your stay here. Hope you understand.

I recently moved here for the same time frame, managed to get a place with a contract for 3 months, & may extend for another 3. When browsing I found a lot of places offering 6 months contracts rather than 12. Less than 6 was less common but certainly available. The process for rental was pretty easy & my apartment is serviced 1-2 times a week.

I'd say that food costs would be pretty similar to BKK but drinking a little cheaper. If you don't want to get a motorbike stick with district 1, though if you go further out you'll get a much bigger place for your money. Personally I'm happy in a  small place in a good location, but not for everyone. Hope that's helpful!

Wouldn't be looking to get a car or bike so Q1 seems to be the place to stay then.

I recently moved here for the same time frame, managed to get a place with a contract for 3 months, & may extend for another 3. When browsing I found a lot of places offering 6 months contracts rather than 12. Less than 6 was less common but certainly available. The process for rental was pretty easy & my apartment is serviced 1-2 times a week.

And how did you find your apartment?

And how much are you paying p/m?

Hi,

I really like the way you made questions. I guess you are a person know what you want and how to achieve very well.

I just want to say that if the apartment renting is over 600$, it's rather to rent a house cos total fee will be over 800$  . I saw a germany girl rent a 3bedrooms house which locates in Thao dien, dist 2 at 650$ only.

Regards

I wouldn't pay $600-$800 a month to live in Saigon. I can rent an apartment in the UK cheaper than that.

The beauty for me of living in SE Asia is I can have a better standard of living for much less (at least I could in BKK) but if I have to pay similar prices as to what you pay in the UK then it's not so worth it.

I'd pay more to live in Vietnam than in the UK.  Better food, warmer weather, prettier women, and most of all, far more fun in general.

Sure the weather, food, and women might be nicer but I don't like the UK prices so I don't want to pay UK prices in a developing country where things should in theory be cheaper.

Why should things be cheaper?  I mean, it's great that they are cheaper, but you have a better standard of living in Vietnam or Thailand for a whole host of reasons (food, weather, beaches, nightlife, etc.) due to the nature of those countries.   It seems like that should cost more.  The fact that it's cheaper is icing on the cake.

One thing I've noticed:  Most Vietnamese these days (women, in particular) don't want to leave their country.  Same goes for Thais. (Filipinos are the opposite -- they all seem to want to get out, but that's another discussion).  Most Vietnamese recognize their country is pretty great and they'd be giving up a lot if they left.

Many people who live even in the poorest of countries that have endless problems (war etc) love their country and don't want to move.

You see refugees from Syria who have had to flee because of war who pray they can just go home even though they have nothing to go home to.

Then there are those who can't wait to get out.

It's the same all over the world. Some want out. Some want to stay,

Places like Vietnam should be cheaper because it's a developing country with a much lower standard of living / income.

And not EVERYTHING is better in these countries. Sure you get nice weather, can live really well for not too much money, the foods great etc but...

There's many aspects of the UK (where I'm from) that are much better than Thailand (where I've been living) and I'm sure better than Vietnam too - social system, education, healthy system, public services, roads, public transport, traffic etc.

So it's swings and roundabouts.

You get to live a nice life in countries like Vietnam and Thailand if you have enough money to shut yourself off from the problems locals on a low income face but if you're broke in Vietnam or Thailand life wouldn't be that amazing.

Scotsman84 wrote:

Many people who live even in the poorest of countries that have endless problems (war etc) love their country and don't want to move.

Have you been to the Philippines?

Places like Vietnam should be cheaper because it's a developing country with a much lower standard of living / income.

Honestly, if you think the standard of living in Vietnam is "much lower" than the UK, you should live in the UK.  I disagree with that premise completely.  There are benefits of Vietnam you simply can't get in the UK, or any first-world country.  Income potential is another matter, but you said yourself that isn't an issue for you (and it isn't for me, either, BTW).

All those things you mention as benefits of the UK ("social system, education, healthy system, public services, roads, public transport, traffic ") also apply to most first-world countries, but they mean very little to me.  In fact, they strike me as mostly characteristics of a mind-numbing, antiseptic society.  I much prefer riding a motorbike in Saigon than driving a car in the United States.  Vietnamese healthcare is completely adequate, and Thai even more-so.  The rest?  I don't see how they rank highly to a single male with sufficient money in the bank.

You get to live a nice life in countries like Vietnam and Thailand if you have enough money to shut yourself off from the problems locals on a low income face but if you're broke in Vietnam or Thailand life wouldn't be that amazing.

That's not really the issue, is it?  Neither of us is broke. I could afford to live in a nice place in the US or Europe (I have family in Tuscany) for about the same costs as Vietnam.  I'm sure you could do something similar -- there are plenty of lovely places in the UK, outside of London, where you could have a decent standard of living for not a lot of money.  The problem is, all those places are BORING.  It's Groundhog Day, every day.  Regardless of the roads, transit system, schools, etc.

Have not been to the Phils. It's the only country out of my 3 potential options (Vietnam, Cambodia, Phils) that I've not been to.

How long have you been living in Vietnam?

I could be wrong but it seems like you are still in the honey moon period.

IME no matter where you live things start to become samey and normal the longer you live there.

BKK at first seemed like a crazy place that would never stop being interesting and whilst I still love it right now there's no denying that after a while it's just like living anywhere else.

You get used to your surroundings and every day can quite easily be the same if you're in a routine.

Sure if you have money, are free to do as you please, and don't have to deal with a lot of day to day struggles that other people face then you have some control over that but still it's no different from living anywhere else really.

It could easily be claimed living in London, Saigon, BKK or anywhere else is like Groundhog Day.

All I'm saying is everywhere has it's ups and downs. Nowhere is a true paradise. There are pro's and con's of living everywhere.

I didnt advice you to rent a home at 650$.

Many things of VN is more expensive than Thai. We cant change it and if you want to stay here, you have to accept it. It can be much cheaper if you live in Da Lat, Da nang..not Hcm and Ha Noi. To me, if I usually stay at home, I will rent a comfortable place. If not, just a shelter is enough. But food is different. I like eating nice food only.

I think no one can tell you what you will have when you live here. " prettier ladies" or "being treated like a King"..?? Just you can answer yourself after staying here long enough.

To the OP:

If you are the kind of person that likes going out 3-4 times a week, and wants to go out on a lot of dates/meet new people, I can guarantee that you will spend more than $1200 a month, and probably much more. Going out in HCMC can get expensive quick. Yes there's a bunch of places you can drink for dirt cheap such as the backpacking area, but honestly, it's not my cup of tea (you may love it however). There are many "expat bars" where it can still be cheap (think roughly 2.50 USD a beer) but if you are younger or are going out on dates or want to meet girls, you probably won't find them in these types of establishments. All of the bars or clubs where you would probably bring your dates will cost you in the neighborhood of $5-$6 USD a drink. You say you will eat local 90% of the time, but if you are going out on a lot of dates that number might drop significantly. Paying for dinner for 2 and drinks out afterwards will eat up your budget in no time.

Another thing to think of is transportation. If you'll only be here for say 3 months, you may not want to buy a bike or rent. That leaves you with just taxis (or xe om's). Yes, taxis, in Vietnam are cheaper than other metropolitan cities, but when they are your only mode of transportation, it adds up QUICKLY. Trust me I know. There isn't any form of public transportation here in Saigon (well, not like Bangkok that is)

If you want to live by yourself in D1, prices are extremely inflated for foreigners, but that's just how it is. You could save money by sharing an apartment with someone or just getting  a room in a shared house with a bunch of strangers, but that's not for everyone. To live by yourself in a studio in D1 not sharing any amenities with anyone would set you back at least $500 a month.

Based on your description, I think you're closer to $1600-$1700 a month (based on $500 for rent). $1100 (give or take) a month for everything else may seem like a lot, but it's not. I know some expats on here here will scoff at my estimations and say "I live for under $300 a month!" or something ridiculous, but honestly, that's not realistic unless you wanna eat rice with fish sauce for breakfast, lunch, or dinner, and sit at home in your room locked up everyday.

Jason Bourne

JasonBourne1 wrote:

To the OP:

If you are the kind of person that likes going out 3-4 times a week, and wants to go out on a lot of dates/meet new people, I can guarantee that you will spend more than $1200 a month, and probably much more. Going out in HCMC can get expensive quick. Yes there's a bunch of places you can drink for dirt cheap such as the backpacking area, but honestly, it's not my cup of tea (you may love it however). There are many "expat bars" where it can still be cheap (think roughly 2.50 USD a beer) but if you are younger or are going out on dates or want to meet girls, you probably won't find them in these types of establishments. All of the bars or clubs where you would probably bring your dates will cost you in the neighborhood of $5-$6 USD a drink. You say you will eat local 90% of the time, but if you are going out on a lot of dates that number might drop significantly. Paying for dinner for 2 and drinks out afterwards will eat up your budget in no time.

Another thing to think of is transportation. If you'll only be here for say 3 months, you may not want to buy a bike or rent. That leaves you with just taxis (or xe om's). Yes, taxis, in Vietnam are cheaper than other metropolitan cities, but when they are your only mode of transportation, it adds up QUICKLY. Trust me I know. There isn't any form of public transportation here in Saigon (well, not like Bangkok that is)

If you want to live by yourself in D1, prices are extremely inflated for foreigners, but that's just how it is. You could save money by sharing an apartment with someone or just getting  a room in a shared house with a bunch of strangers, but that's not for everyone. To live by yourself in a studio in D1 not sharing any amenities with anyone would set you back at least $500 a month.

Based on your description, I think you're closer to $1600-$1700 a month (based on $500 for rent). $1100 (give or take) a month for everything else may seem like a lot, but it's not. I know some expats on here here will scoff at my estimations and say "I live for under $300 a month!" or something ridiculous, but honestly, that's not realistic unless you wanna eat rice with fish sauce for breakfast, lunch, or dinner, and sit at home in your room locked up everyday.

Jason Bourne

Thanks for the info Jason.

Maybe I've been spoiled in BKK by just how budget friendly everything is even when you're out drinking, eating out etc all the time.

Yeah the backpacker area likely isn't my cup of tea either. In 1 year in BKK I went to Kowsarn Road 4 times and all 4 times because friends were in town and staying there, Otherwise I wouldn't go.

Not really into the idea of sharing an apartment or house and yeah I didn't factor in lack of transport into budget. I wouldn't drive a bike so taxis would be the only option I guess.

Something that you don't need to use so often in BKK because of skytrain / MRT / khlong etc

$1700 a month is doable. I can afford it but it is a bit more than I've been spending in Thailand and a lot of what I've been reading over the past few weeks told me Siagon would be cheaper than BKK which maybe isn't quite so true after what I've discovered here.

Gives me a bit to think about.

Thanks.

@Scotsman84

I think you could easily spend $1700 a month or even more. I paid $1600 for my roundtrip ticket from Miami, Fl. to Saigon and $7000 on misc.  in less than 3 months. I stayed at mom's vacation home in the country where it is supposed to be cheaper than the big cities. I have a large family in VN and when I am out and about, they all want to come and I am the one that pays for everyone. How many I take with me is my choice of course. But it gets costly being around relatives in VN.  If you don't have a job, school or family members to occupy your days, things get really boring. Believe me.  Yes, street food is cheap, because it's street food. Dining-in costs more but at least you have a/c and sanitary w/c, and you can eat in peace without lottery ticket solicitors interrupting your meals. Those are just my personal experiences. I'm not really saying they are good or bad, just that it's something to think about.

Yours will be different because you are a "single man"? Want a girlfriend? It's gonna cost. How much that depends on you and her. This is gonna sound funny but it might not be too bad in having one. If she has a motorbike, which almost everyone does then you might not have to worry too much about hiring out for transportation. She will speak fluent VNmese and she could show you around and also negotiate prices for you. That would definitely save you money and many a headaches.  I guess what I am suggesting is that you could do the "AncientPathos" way. It seems to work for him. 

Bottom line is "Paradise is relative", one's dream can be another's nightmare.  Vietnam does have more than just coffee shops, bars, cheap food stalls, and pretty women.   Stay for 3 months then if you like it then extend as many times as possible. If you don't like it, then move on to other destination. There is a whole world out there to explore. Just be sure to budget for emergencies. Better safe than sorry. 

I don't want a girlfriend.

I'm young, free and single and plan to stay that way.

I do plan to date and have casual relationships however (that doesn't mean pay for play btw).

So sure I imagine I'll probably pick up the tab on dates more often than not but I'm not going to be splashing the cash on any girl to be my girlfriend.

In Vietnam when you go out with a girl is it always expected the man will pay?

In Thailand it can go either way. Some will expect you to pick up the tab and make no effort to pay and others will split or even offer to pay at times.

Yeah sure I could stay for 3 months then move on if it's not for me but getting an apartment for 3 months might be tricky and over priced and I would ideally like to get into a routine as I have things to do online so being settles is nice.

Scotsman84 wrote:

I don't want a girlfriend.

I'm young, free and single and plan to stay that way.

I do plan to date and have casual relationships however (that doesn't mean pay for play btw).

So sure I imagine I'll probably pick up the tab on dates more often than not but I'm not going to be splashing the cash on any girl to be my girlfriend.

In Vietnam when you go out with a girl is it always expected the man will pay?

In Thailand it can go either way. Some will expect you to pick up the tab and make no effort to pay and others will split or even offer to pay at times.

Yeah sure I could stay for 3 months then move on if it's not for me but getting an apartment for 3 months might be tricky and over priced and I would ideally like to get into a routine as I have things to do online so being settles is nice.

In Vietnam, it is generally assumed that the guy will ALWAYS pay. You might get that one very few who offers to pay every once in a while but it is so rare that I wouldn't even think about it. Not only will you pay for her, but she'll bring her friends along as well and expect you to pick up the tab. Sometimes she'll even bring her water buffalo along (water buffalo eat alot and you'll be left with the tab as well).

I agree with Jason above although I think $1600 is slightly conservative IF you like going out. I'm a social drinker myself and since I don't really care for the backpacking area, drinking adds up. People on here are always talking about going to these cheap ass places and getting cheap liquor, but all those places serve fake liquor. Don't believe me? I know a company that can even siphon the Heineken out of cans and reseal it back along with all the Vodka they take (and put who knows what back in). You get what you pay for...  Again you could cut down on your expenses by getting a shared place, but you already mentioned that's not something your interested in ,and quite frankly, I don't blame you. I'm one of those people that thinks it's always better to over estimate then under estimate so I would say $2000/ month and you will live very well. I can't tell you how many expats I know that have come here and are shocked by how much more they spend a month than originally planned.

Hope that helps

Re: Dating.  You're free to have as many casual relationships as you wish with women, but once you sleep with one, she's your girlfriend.  Actually, implied fiancee, because she's thinking marriage at that point.  That is, unless they are hookers ("chicken", "taxi-girls", etc.). 

Re:  Paying on a date.  You're not expected to pay because you're a man, you're expected to pay because you're a foreigner  (tongue firmly planted in cheek).  In any case, you will always be expected to pay for your date, and any friend/cousin/sister she brings along, which is common because most "good" Vietnamese girls will feel uncomfortable being seen in public alone with a foreigner (lest people think she's a chicken).

Re:  Apartments.  It's not hard to find a serviced studio apartment in D1, roughly 35 sqm, for $350-$400.  You just need to be prepared to walk around, look for signs, and talk to people.  You're not likely going to find them on Craigslist, but you should be able to find something within a few days (e.g., book a $20-per-night hotel, and explore).

Re:  Transportation.  If you're not comfortable with a 100cc+ motorbike, consider renting a 50cc Honda Cub, or an electric bike.  D1 is very walkable, but the city really opens itself up once you have your own transportation. MIA2013's suggestion about having a girlfriend with a motorbike is a good one, although you might feel odd having a Vietnamese girl drive you around all the time (for both of you).

JVo18 wrote:

I'm a social drinker myself and since I don't really care for the backpacking area, drinking adds up. People on here are always talking about going to these cheap ass places and getting cheap liquor, but all those places serve fake liquor.

Totally agree on the fake liquor (sure, I'll have some "Jack Daniels") but serious question:  Why not stick to Saigons, or 333?  At $2 each (or less),  could you really drink more than $10 worth in any given evening?  Every day?

DanFromSF wrote:

JVo18 wrote:

I'm a social drinker myself and since I don't really care for the backpacking area, drinking adds up. People on here are always talking about going to these cheap ass places and getting cheap liquor, but all those places serve fake liquor.

Totally agree on the fake liquor (sure, I'll have some "Jack Daniels") but serious question:  Why not stick to Saigons, or 333?  At $2 each (or less),  could you really drink more than $10 worth in any given evening?  Every day?

I definitely agree. I don't mind the Saigon Green Special's (not the regular Saigon green's), and since I'm a lightweight. $5 in the backpacking area is a crazy night out for me haha. But all joking aside, I suffer slightly from claustrophobia, which is why I'm not a huge fan of the backpacking area.

In Vietnam, it is generally assumed that the guy will ALWAYS pay. You might get that one very few who offers to pay every once in a while but it is so rare that I wouldn't even think about it. Not only will you pay for her, but she'll bring her friends along as well and expect you to pick up the tab. Sometimes she'll even bring her water buffalo along (water buffalo eat alot and you'll be left with the tab as well).

Can't wait to meet the buffalo.

Everyone says the same about Thailand though that Thai girls always turn up on dates with several friends in tow.

I have dated a lot of Thai girls and can only think of once when a girl turned up with a friend.

Other times they asked before coming "can I bring a friend" and I'd just say "no I want to meet you not your friend" and that solved the problem. Girl turned up alone.

So really there's no chance of getting a Vietnamese girl out alone?

Trying to have a date with 1 girl who has a friend or several friends with her all talking away in Vietnamese and me being expected to entertain them all isn't really my idea of fun.

I'm one of those people that thinks it's always better to over estimate then under estimate so I would say $2000/ month and you will live very well. I can't tell you how many expats I know that have come here and are shocked by how much more they spend a month than originally planned.

Yeah I understand what you are saying.

It's easy to convince yourself you'll just eat cheap food 3x a day, not go out every night, not waste money on Western food, not drink too often etc and that it'll only cost $X a month and then you get there and you just can't do it.

I know I won't do that. I won't be throwing money around left, right and centre but I will want to be comfortable and enjoy myself.

I'm not going to convince myself I'll happily spend 6 nights a week in my apartment in front of the TV as it won't happen.

Re: Dating.  You're free to have as many casual relationships as you wish with women, but once you sleep with one, she's your girlfriend.  Actually, implied fiancee, because she's thinking marriage at that point.  That is, unless they are hookers ("chicken", "taxi-girls", etc.).

Looks like there's going to be a lot of disappointed girls then.

Again heard all this about Thai girls and didn't find it to be true at all.

Plenty of students and graduates who were happy to casually date or be 'giks' (I'll let you work out what that means  ) and didn't want anything serious.

Sure many were hoping to land a bf but I'm always honest with any girl I meet that I don't want anything serious, long term, don't plan to settle down and get married, have kids etc.

No interest in hookers.

Paying on a date.  You're not expected to pay because you're a man, you're expected to pay because you're a foreigner  (tongue firmly planted in cheek).  In any case, you will always be expected to pay for your date, and any friend/cousin/sister she brings along, which is common because most "good" Vietnamese girls will feel uncomfortable being seen in public alone with a foreigner (lest people think she's a chicken).

It's really such a big deal?

Again sorry to keep banging on about Thailand but I heard all the same there but I found the students and graduates actually had no problem with it at all because it was clear she wasn't a hooker and I wasn't a whoremonger.

Most of them had no problem with it and no one paid any attention and this was in BKK which has a reputation for it's naughty nightlife etc.

Saigon doesn't really have that reputation as far as I know.

Re:  Apartments.  It's not hard to find a serviced studio apartment in D1, roughly 35 sqm, for $350-$400.  You just need to be prepared to walk around, look for signs, and talk to people.  You're not likely going to find them on Craigslist, but you should be able to find something within a few days (e.g., book a $20-per-night hotel, and explore).

Thanks for the advice. Will be sure to do that if I land in Saigon.

Re:  Transportation.  If you're not comfortable with a 100cc+ motorbike, consider renting a 50cc Honda Cub, or an electric bike.  D1 is very walkable, but the city really opens itself up once you have your own transportation. MIA2013's suggestion about having a girlfriend with a motorbike is a good one, although you might feel odd having a Vietnamese girl drive you around all the time (for both of you).

You couldn't pay me to ride a bike anywhere let alone in Saigon. I've seen those 12 lanes of bike traffic. Chaos.

It wouldn't be the first time I've ridden around on the back of a chicks bike in SE Asia. Not bothered by it at all.

Thanks, I know what a gik is.  The fact that Thais have such a term (or mia noi), but the Vietnamese do not (as far as I know) should tell you something.

Sounds like you have a handle on things, so I'm going to punch out at this point.  Good luck!

Well that indeed does say a lot.

Your advice is appreciated sorry if it didn't seem that way.

Not at all.  I just get overwhelmed trying to explain things when nothing is truly an absolute.  There are always exceptions to everything, so I think all we can do is paint a picture, not give you a photograph.

As far as girls, it's my observation that Vietnamese women are the least "easy" (by far), followed by Thais, and then Filipinas.  In general, they require you to pursue them, and are far more sexually conservative.  I've never met one that would pay at a restaurant, but if you leave them in your place for 10 minutes, you'll return to find all your clothes perfectly folded, all your papers organized, by date, and a delicious meal waiting for you.  (This kinda drives me crazy, to tell you the truth, but that's my problem ).

Again, all generalizations.  YMMV.  I suggest you get your boots on the ground and discover for yourself.  It's not Thailand;  whether it's better or worse is for you to decide.  I know where I stand on the issue.

I don't really like people messing around with my stuff or moving my apartment around either so might bug me a bit too.

The cooking bit is OK though.

JVo18 wrote:

I definitely agree. I don't mind the Saigon Green Special's (not the regular Saigon green's), and since I'm a lightweight. $5 in the backpacking area is a crazy night out for me haha. But all joking aside, I suffer slightly from claustrophobia, which is why I'm not a huge fan of the backpacking area.

Yep, same here.  Honestly, I'd rather hang with some locals on a little plastic chair, even if their english is limited (and my Vietnamese nonexistent). 

Buying your own beer saves a ton of money, so to get the night started on the cheap, a 333 from the corner store and a banh mi from the cart out front makes me happy.  That's a $2 dinner.  What does $2 buy you in the US?

DanFromSF wrote:

Thanks, I know what a gik is.  The fact that Thais have such a term (or mia noi), but the Vietnamese do not (as far as I know) should tell you something.

กิ๊ก [gik]= bồ nhí, chân dài đại gia, gái bao,...
เมีย น้อย [mia noi] = vợ bé, phòng nhì,...

funboi wrote:

[
กิ๊ก [gik]= bồ nhí, chân dài đại gia, gái bao,...
เมีย น้อย [mia noi] = vợ bé, phòng nhì,...

Thanks for the correction;  I've never heard these used in conversation.

No problem. Ask any Vietnamese (men especially) and they will tell you right away what they mean :-), as those are commonly used slangs, just like their corresponding Thai terms.

But, I don't think the concepts are as accepted as they are in Thai culture.  Correct me if I'm wrong on that.

DanFromSF wrote:

But, I don't think the concepts are as accepted as they are in Thai culture.  Correct me if I'm wrong on that.

From what I have seen, they are as widely practiced in Vietnam as in Thailand. In both countries, they are not practiced among traditional, educated people, but among the nouveau riche, cadres who get rich because of bribery: the Vietnamese, learnt from their Chinese counterparts, easily exceed the Thais.

vợ bé, phòng nhì,... are quite old terms. Rich Vietnamese men used to have two, three wives back in the old days (colonial era and earlier). Just look at the emperors and their cocubines.

bồ nhí, chân dài đại gia are relative new terms, but so is the Thai term กิ๊ก.

funboi wrote:

From what I have seen, they are as widely practiced in Vietnam as in Thailand. In both countries, they are not practiced among traditional, educated people, but among the nouveau riche, cadres who get rich because of bribery: the Vietnamese, learnt from their Chinese counterparts, easily exceed the Thais.

As a foreigner, it seems different to me in the two countries.  It seems like a gik in Thailand is almost a pop culture thing, that everybody knows about and it's commonly accepted, at least among 20-somethings.  That doesn't seem to be the case in Vietnam, though.  Are the Vietnamese just more discreet about it, or am I hanging with the wrong people?

DanSF
Your question is so ambigious so it is hard for me to give a definite answer.

Again gik is a new term, just like the term "hook-up", so it may mean different things to different people. In different forums, people widely disagree what they actually mean. It also means differently for different age groups.

Among the 20-somethings in Thailand, gik means a less committed relationship. At least, from what I have seen, it is more common to have boyfriend/girlfriend (แฟน) than to have gik.
Having said so, the Thai is more sexually liberal than the Vietnamese, so having sex (both in long-term relationship and through one-night stands) is not a social taboo thing, so people are more open to talk about it.

The young Vietnamese crowd is more toward having relationship for marriage, thus more traditional. Having said so, among the educated young, especially the privileged, casual sex and partner hopping is not a rare thing, to put it mildly. In addition, Vietnamese are not open to talk about sex in general. When they do talk about it, they speak in "codes".

Therefore, this aspect/practice of the society is not obvious for the casual outsiders (and foreigners), thus you may not have heard much about it.

In general, the term gik and their Vietnamese terms are mostly intended for adulterous relationship, thus my earlier comments about the nouveau riche, government officials and their widespread habit

I had thought the definition of a gik was someone, male or female, with whom you have a uncommitted relationship, with some amount of shared activity and intimacy, that might vary depending on the circumstances.  In other words, more than a friend, but less than a boyfriend/girlfriend, at least in terms of commitment.  How else do people define it?

It seems to me the arrangement is more common in Thailand than Vietnam,  but I'll accept your premise that it's practised equally in both places.  My previous point that there isn't even a word for it in Vietnam was a bad assumption on my part.  I should have said it's not spoken about as freely as it is in Thailand -- which I think we agree is true.   

So, there you go, OP.  One less thing to worry about as long as you can crack the "code".

When people say gik in Thailand they just mean a regular f*ck buddy. Nothing serious. Casual sex when it suits each other with no commitments.

Many Thai girls aged 21-35 are open to it in my experience. I guess some may be hoping it leads to something further down the line.

I wouldn't say it's something people speak about often in Thailand, at least not IME anyway, but many people have giks that I know.