Is your Apartment Secure? Are you sure?

Jaitch wrote:

I said NO ONE enters my apartment UNLESS I allow it. He said Foreigners are always the ones causing him problems!

Funny isn't it how this always seems to be a much greater problem in developing nations where people tend not to have any concept of PRIVACY and don't respect other people's right to it. Yeah, I guess that we nasty "Foreigners" would always be the ones causing people like your apartment manager problems because not only do we have a cultural respect for the privacy and private space/property of others, but we come from countries where there are strong laws to protect that concept. What I really can't seem to wrap my head around is why the locals simply accept this as normal and don't place a value on their own privacy.

I'd like to see an apartment manager anywhere back in Canada try to enter a tenant's apartment without permission (except under emergency situations clearly defined by law); if he didn't end up getting shot or tossed off the 12th floor balcony by the tenant in the process, he would find himself standing in front of a Provincial Court judge facing charges of Break and Enter so fast his head would be spinning.

The situation you describe isn't much different here in Brazil. I have just let it be known to my landlords anywhere I've rented in Brazil that I own a 9 mm. Glock semi-automatic (which I really don't) and casually let it slip out that I wouldn't hesitate one second to shoot anyone who tries to enter my apartment. I've gotten some rather strange looks at times, but one thing is for sure - from that point onward EVERY LAST ONE OF THEM has either phoned or knocked on my door and asked permission whenever there has been some need to enter my apartment.

Great post, thanks for sharing it.

Cheers,
William James Woodward, EB Experts Team

Nice post Jaitch!

Dear Billy James, just the rumour of a Glock pistol in your apartment would bring the authorities sweeping down on you in Vietnam, where you would likely spend some time in confinement until you convinced them otherwise.

Vietnam may be developing in the economic sense, but they do have well developed cultural values with include concepts of personal privacy, but not necessarily ones that match the "man's home is his castle" concept enshrined in Anglo-American common law and the 4th Amendment of the US Constitution. So your post, while entertaining, is both silly, and irrelevant.

lirelou wrote:

So your post, while entertaining, is both silly, and irrelevant.

Well said.

Jaitch wrote:

Many people assume their apartments are secure from intrusion. Delusional.

Thanks for this post;  it's something I have been thinking about.

Here's another question:  Have you been successful in securing an area INSIDE your apartment with a good padlock?  i.e., a closet.  If so, how did you do it?

DanFromSF wrote:

Here's another question:  Have you been successful in securing an area INSIDE your apartment with a good padlock?  i.e., a closet.  If so, how did you do it?

The smaller a 'safe compartment' is the easier it is to secure. The weaknesses are hinge and lock areas. Placing longer screws in these fittings is a start, after making sure the lock tumbler system has been switched.

'External' Hinges
=============
Many hinges, especially on small cubicles, have their PIN on the outside and a nail, or similar, and a hammer will knock the pin out. In these cases. With the door open and from the 'room' side, drill a hole through the hinge hardware and the honge pin. The hole should be large enough for a small nail, or pin.

Insert the nail and then the pin is as secure as the hinge body.

Buying New Locks
==============
Don't skimp, buy a decent one, preferably from Germany, Locks with 'flat' keys (with dimples) are less secure than older style 'curved' types (Yale style).

DO NOT BUY A LOCK FROM THE INSTALLER. There have been a number of cases where a supplying locksmith has copied a key before installing and selling it to thieves. Buy your lock then have a local installer fit the lock - then make sure you have all the keys!

Reinforcing Doors
==============
The basic door reinforcement, after using longer/stringer screws, is to run metal bars from the hinges, diagonally to the lock. They must be secured to the hinges and the lock. The hinges could be placed over the bar with mounting screws THROUGH the bars.

Likewise with locks, the should be mounted through the bars.

Securing Sliding Doors/Windows
==========================
Sliding doors and windows are an easy way to enter an apartment.. There are TWO ways to make intrusion harder.

One is sticking small bits of Acrilex in the upper track of a moving door, so they can't be lifted out of their tracks. The other way is the drill holes through the frame AND window (BUT NOT ALL THE WAY THROUGH THE OUTSIDE FRAME) and place a HEADLESS pin in the holes - which can be pulled out by finger.

These pins will prevent sliding and lifting the sliding member.

Fire Safety
=========
Always make provision for speedy exit - having a key near the exit (not NEXT to the lock!). The same applies to window bars - likely a padlock can be used.

Remember that TP HCM fire ladders cannot extend above the SIXTH FLOOR, so escape from a higher floor, through the balcony, is unlikely.

Strangers visiting your house?
========================
So stranger visitors can't see what you have, cover all your valuables such as computers, etc., with sheets. Visitors will think you are only trying to keep the dust off. Knowing what a person has, and their home security, goes a long way for breaking in.

Sucks that anyone needs to take all these precautions when its the manager's responsibility to ensure every tenant's room is secure.

mikeymyke wrote:

Sucks that anyone needs to take all these precautions when its the manager's responsibility to ensure every tenant's room is secure.

It's obviously NOT that way in Vietnam Mikey, sad comment on the society as a whole, really. I don't know how anyone can say, as did @lirelou that "but they do have well developed cultural values with include concepts of personal privacy." If they don't respect the privacy of one's home, which after all is the most fundamental privacy of all.

OXYMORON / noun [C]
two words used together which have, or seem to have, opposite meanings

Cheers,
William James Woodward, EB Experts Team

wjwoodward wrote:

... they do have well developed cultural values with include concepts of personal privacy.

'Privacy' in single room houses is strange - they use the (invisible) Chinese Wall principle - you try not to see - or look! I have often stayed in such places and they mostly diplomatically suggest that the guest might want to go to bed first. In the morning they will get up early and leave the room empty for the guest to get dressed alone.

I find certain students I teach in my HCM apartment are quite nosy - they will pick up letters/documents from my desk and start reading them! When the offenders are due, I cover my desk with a sheet.

Hi Jaitch,

Sorry but the quote wasn't mine, it was a quote from the posting by lirelou (reply #4) which I found to be a total oxymoron.

If a culture has values and respects privacy then they respect the privacy of your home. If they don't respect the privacy of your home then they simply don't have values or respect privacy. They go hand in hand.

Personally, I wouldn't remain two weeks in an apartment or a country where I didn't have privacy or feel safe in my own home. Just not worth the headaches.

Cheers,
wjw

wjwoodward wrote:

Personally, I wouldn't remain two weeks in an apartment or a country where I didn't have privacy or feel safe in my own home. Just not worth the headaches.

Actually VietNam has more freedom than many, including Singapore.  Unless you get mixed up on politics or preaching religion the average visitor rarely gets involved with the law.

Apartment managers and owners are just as nosy in other countries - Foreigners tend to ignore the risks, so they should be alert to precautions they can take. I feel safer here than in HoingKong or NYC and definitely Dallas or Houston..

Jaitch wrote:

Apartment managers and owners are just as nosy in other countries - Foreigners tend to ignore the risks,

Have you been back to Canada recently? Every Province has a Residential Tenancy Act or Tenant - Landlord Act that states clearly under what conditions a landlord/manager/agent can enter a residence without prior consent, they are ONLY the most serious emergency situations. While Canadian apartment managers may well be nosy they sure as Hell don't go entering into apartments without permission because at least in Canada they land in jail for doing this.

I sure wouldn't do well in VN, and wouldn't even try moving there because of this issue alone, that doesn't even begin to take into consideration all the other negative points about living in the country I constantly hear.

Cheers,
wjw

Hi guys.

I would like to react to Jaitch's comments.
Sorry to say Jaitch, and be sure I don't want to offend you, but it seems you're somewhat paranoiac!
Of course you need to take some common sense precautions for your own safety and your house's one, but man, I do think you're going way too far!!
There's a house in Xuan Thuy Street, Thao Dien, Q2 (sorry for accents!). There's about 20 camera on the front. Is it your house?? Any security can be broken, whatever you do, so you can :
- have the strongest hinge
- buy new locks (german!!!)
- Reinforce doors
- secure sliding doors/windows
- cover your valuables with a sheet (just put them in a buffet or wardrobe)
etc etc etc
... if some wants to enter your house, he will.

How do you feel with your internet connection, your mobile phone, your credit card? Don't you feel tracked?

But you're right when you say that tenant don't need to get the keys of your house and "spying cameras" are far too intrusive.

Again sorry, I do not want to offend you, I just want to point out I found security in VN really good. Just look at young girls with (very) short dresses walking in the streets at night, that's a good sign.

Don't cause temptation, you won't have any problem, as any other country in the world.

Sorry for bad english! :-)

PhilRivera: What Jaitch has posted isn't for everyone - only those who seem not to be aware that the issues he outlines do exist here in Vietnam. I'm talking about those who sit in streetside cafes with their iPhone or iPad laying on the table while they drink or eat, only to have it stolen from under their noses. Then they act like Vietnam is such a terrible, crime-ridden place. The fact is, because VN is a relatively poor, developing country, there are more desperate people here willing to take chances. The same is true with would-be thieves entering apartments. And as Jaitch has pointed out in previous posts, because security guards are grossly underpaid, often they are in on the crimes as well. So everyone needs to know and be well-aware of their situation, and prepare accordingly.  I feel relatively secure where I live, but ONLY because I've lived there for 7 years - 6 in the same apartment, and all the security staff knows me. I trust them because they've shown me through their past actions that they can be trusted. But if I was a new tenant, or any of them were new staff, I would not trust them.  As for landlords, again, everyone's situation is different. My landlord doesn't even show up to collect the rent until several weeks after it's due, so I'm reasonably certain she's not going to show up to enter my apartment without my permission. My wife and baby are at home most of the time anyway. So if you're living alone in VN and relatively new here, it's a good idea to at least have Jaitch's info in the back of your mind, whether you choose to follow it or not.

@saigonmonkey:
Most crimes in VietNam are crimes of opportunity rather than planned.

One of the best defences against break-ins is making friends with your neighbours who get to know you and your visitors.

Interpol rates VietNam safer than many countries including the USA - and they have police on the street.

"I sure wouldn't do well in VN, and wouldn't even try moving there because of this issue alone, that doesn't even begin to take into consideration all the other negative points about living in the country I constantly hear."

Cheers,wjw

Then why come on a Vietnam forum and take issue with people on posts concerning subjects you've had no personal experience with? Surely the Brazil forum must have some threads that excite your interest.

lirelou wrote:

"I sure wouldn't do well in VN, and wouldn't even try moving there because of this issue alone, that doesn't even begin to take into consideration all the other negative points about living in the country I constantly hear."

Cheers,wjw

Then why come on a Vietnam forum and take issue with people on posts concerning subjects you've had no personal experience with? Surely the Brazil forum must have some threads that excite your interest.

Because this is a wanna be 'expat' forum.
lireou, this site is for folks who can't Google.
Don't beat yourself up over ignoramuses .
Or help them find out if the water is safe to drink.
Or where to get a job/ apartment/  work permit/  visa/  language study/  new foreign friends et al.

Jaitch wrote:

@saigonmonkey:
Most crimes in VietNam are crimes of opportunity rather than planned.

One of the best defences against break-ins is making friends with your neighbours who get to know you and your visitors.

Interpol rates VietNam safer than many countries including the USA - and they have police on the street.

Totally agree. Especially the part about making friends with neighbors. I'm also friendly with my security staff and give them all red envelopes at Tet holiday. I'm probably the only tenant in the complex who does that, and I'm looked after very well for it.

Of course not secure anywhere!
Many apartment management staff, security staff or even parking lot staff consider owners/tenants as their servants and behave like "THIS IS MY APARTMENT, IF YOU WANT TO STAY JUST OBEY ME"!!! What an idiotic thought, right?
When we buy/rent apartment we have all rights conferred by the constitution. We pay money for them to protect us and our property. Government apartment staffs are the worse I ever seen in service. Vietnamese citizens are irresponsible and ignorant of their rights. They never complain anything.

DBase Vietnam wrote:

Vietnamese citizens are irresponsible and ignorant of their rights. They never complain anything.

Wow, about 90 million Vietnamese, 90 million irresponsible, 90 million ignorant of their rights and 90 million never complaining.

For sure, 90 million will appreciate...

Can't remember who talked about "idiotic thought".

Point 1: Dont let anyone inside if you dont feel like it Perhaps the cops, once you see some ID. The landlord is NOT allowed to get inside your rooms once you rent it.This is applied to *Vietnamese*, so any landlord say otherwise is untrustable. My mother has a small house rent to Vietnamese and that's how we do it. If we want to check the state of the house, we call ahead and the renters will stay at home to greet us.

Point 2: Secure your locks. Buy your own locks from a shop faraway and replace the old ones. The thieves in Vietnamese  is awesome, and can tweak certain kinds of lock open in seconds. The street stalls has a kind of key remaking freelancer who will copy a key without asking anything, in  5 minutes flat, so once a key is out of your hand it might not be safe anymore. If you fire a maid or anyone that can access to your keys, change your locks. This is how Vietnamese do it, not just foreigners. And if landlord want to get inside, they damn well better call you to set up appointment. There's a few situation they need to be inside, like a government-enforced mosquitoes eradication event or something of that level, but if so they still need to contact homeowner first so they are home that day to open the doors.

Point 3: Etiquette. Security guards are people too, and be nice to them is just common sense. Acknowledge them on the street, either greetings or just a smile and nod, call them by name (if you can remember, I cant)... Red envelop during Tet holiday is over and beyond the call of etiquette and is greatly appreciated, since it imply you consider them acquaintances of the level "relatives".

Really?
I don't know that statistics!
You are amazing!
Anyway 90 is lucky number, keep it up!

PhilRiviera wrote:

Wow, about 90 million Vietnamese, 90 million irresponsible, 90 million ignorant of their rights and 90 million never complaining. For sure, 90 million will appreciate...

PhilRiviera wrote:

Can't remember who talked about idiotic thought

Just rewind yourself 
As a sound engineer, you should be sound! Don't be arrogant with just 32 posts!

@DBase Vietnam

That's funny!
Did you noticed that when you quote some comment without the initial quote, meaning this one :

DBase Vietnam wrote:

Vietnamese citizens are irresponsible and ignorant of their rights. They never complain anything.

... one could thing these was my thoughts? 

BTW, what's the relationship between sound engineering, arrogance and number of posts?
Or there's a close relationship between number of posts and one's character? 

Also, as you think Vietnamese are irresponsible, ignorants of their rights and never complain anything, you may think French are arrogant, don't you?

Did you heard about "binary"?

Is there any special rule for quoting?

PhilRiviera wrote:

Did you heard about binary ?

No, is that something edible?

DBase Vietnam wrote:

Is there any special rule for quoting?

No, nothing written at least.

DBase Vietnam wrote:

As a sound engineer

DBase Vietnam wrote:

You are amazing!

DBase Vietnam wrote:

Vietnamese citizens are

DBase Vietnam wrote:

secure anywhere!

DBase Vietnam wrote:

we

DBase Vietnam wrote:

are the worse I ever seen