Why don't Vietnamese understand Vietnamese spoken by a foreigner?

I am here 2 years (in HCMC) and have not had the same experience - although I am not fluent and travel 3 weeks of the month - making it hard to get fluent. Over the years I have found in every country I have been in that you have to help the person "clue in" a little....get their brains ready for what's coming so to speak.

A casual hello in Vietnamese helps the process, then you can follow with the "how are you" etc. In your particular scenario, the retail worker is more than likely a low skilled, low educated person (not always I know) and may not be at all confident speaking with older foreign people. I find the VN people very polite and respectful in general with only a few exceptions.

Lack of confidence happens with well educated people also who have studied English.....in a nutshell, help them clue-in and you will be more successful.

Cheers.

I agree with Ottvantor, I often give the person a chance to realize I am speaking Vietnamese and then usually have good results. Those commenters on this site who keep on saying you have to pronounce the words correctly are on a different planet. In fact you don't have to have the correct pronunciation, just something close and with context. When you hear a Mexican speaking English you understand it and recognize the person as Mexican. When you hear an Indian speaking English you know what he is saying and you know he is Indian. Vietnamese is a tonal language, no more phonetic than any. My Vietnamese sucks and yet I communicate with the Vietnamese in general quite well short of a real conversation. I enjoy the learning process but like anybody get a little peeved trying to talk to a closed mind.

Hi Expats,
I dont think this is your problem and you dont need to worry about it.
Even Vietnameses sometimes dont understand what others are talking, especially when they are coming from different regions in the country.
I think the reason is they are not prepared to listen to your Vietnamese. Because you are a foreigner so they expect you speak English, or some other languages. But if you tell them you can speak Vietnamese well and show them that, then I believe they will understand you just like listening to a Vietnamese.

Talk about deja vu.... this sounds like me 40 years ago trying to speak Vietnamese    and although I finally managed to learn enough to get by everyone still broke out laughing when I tried to say refrigerator in Vietnamese  (tủ lạnh) 

Vietnamese IMO Is not an easy language for those raised speaking  English or a similar langauge who try to adapt their vocal cords to a language where the tones and the pauses can change the meaning of a word entirely - for example mosquito (muỗi) mangling that can cause some blank looks.  I know I've been there and done that.

BUT IMO if you first break the ice with a Xin chào, hôm nay bạn thế nào to get the listeners attention and then excuse your poor Vietnamese most will make an effort to understand you and may even help correct your pronuciation

On the telephone, people can't see that you're a foreigner.

Wow. I am a Vietnamese 100% but i can not understand Vietnamese...the reason is Vietnamese is spoken by many people from many various regions of Viet Nam.Southerner can not understand what Northerner is talking.

I'm Vietnamese and I still get corrected to this day by my own mother. There are certain words which I can't properly pronounce sometimes. I'm what they are considered white-washed over here...lol.

I really can't comprehend some of the arrogance and to be frank pure ignorance that is being wrote here on this subject from expats including the original poster who are somehow implying in no uncertain terms that it's the Vietnamese peoples fault for not being able to understand your incorrect pronunciation in their language. Some of the commenters even have the cheek to say it's basically because they are stupid.
GET A LIFE. It's YOUR fault. No one else's. What are you thinking? All Vietnamese purposefully do it to annoy you? Vietnamese love and respect anyone who tries to speak their language so show some respect to them and learn it properly before you come on here making a fool of yourself with idiotic comments.  Learn it properly you'll be understood from Sapa to Phu Quoc.

LOL couldn't agree more dasiavu. Since expats are guests in someone else country the onus is on them to speak well enough to be understood.

dasiavu wrote:

I really can't comprehend some of the arrogance and to be frank pure ignorance that is being wrote here on this subject from expats including the original poster who are somehow implying in no uncertain terms that it's the Vietnamese peoples fault for not being able to understand your incorrect pronunciation in their language. Some of the commenters even have the cheek to say it's basically because they are stupid.
GET A LIFE. It's YOUR fault. No one else's. What are you thinking? All Vietnamese purposefully do it to annoy you? Vietnamese love and respect anyone who tries to speak their language so show some respect to them and learn it properly before you come on here making a fool of yourself with idiotic comments.  Learn it properly you'll be understood from Sapa to Phu Quoc.

Yes. I might put it a little more delicately, but that's what I meant to suggest; try out your accent over the phone before concluding that the slackjawed misunderstanding is an effect of your appearance.

I remember going to grad school in the U.S. with Koreans who had studied English for years and passed some pretty difficult English exams, yet whose English was *completely* unintelligible. Same story here: the languages are just very, very different phonetically.

It's hard! Practice, practice, practice.

dasiavu wrote:

I really can't comprehend some of the arrogance and to be frank pure ignorance that is being wrote here on this subject from expats including the original poster who are somehow implying in no uncertain terms that it's the Vietnamese peoples fault for not being able to understand your incorrect pronunciation in their language. Some of the commenters even have the cheek to say it's basically because they are stupid.
GET A LIFE. It's YOUR fault. No one else's. What are you thinking? All Vietnamese purposefully do it to annoy you? Vietnamese love and respect anyone who tries to speak their language so show some respect to them and learn it properly before you come on here making a fool of yourself with idiotic comments.  Learn it properly you'll be understood from Sapa to Phu Quoc.

A bit of a radical and maybe harsh response.....in general I don't disagree but there are exceptions.....was in a tea house in Saigon last week. Went to the counter to pay and 5 wait staff were standing there. I said Hello/how are you.....4 sets of eyes lit up and smiled pleasantly and responded and a 5th was staring with a blank look. I singled her out and said it again.....same thing....completely blank look. Then it seemed that all 4 in unison turned to her and said......he said hello and how are you. Even when they said it to her she didn't react. I asked what's up with her.....thinking she may be hearing impaired. One guy said she doesn't understand......I asked how could she not understand when he and 3 others could.....he shrugged his shoulders.....I took it she may be from a region in VN that spoke a dialect and may have been new to the big city.....anyway I will never know but thats a very recent example of a blank stare to well articulated and very simple Tien Viet expressions.

Cheers.

My Vietnamese is still - and will always be - a work in progress. In the beginning I used to get frustrated when Vietnamese couldn't understand my Vietnamese. Now as my skill improves it is less of a problem but still a problem. I have been using the same grocery store for two years and many of the staff are used to me and enjoy a little banter. They always try hard to understand my Vietnamese and usually with success. Yesterday while getting my vegetables weighed by regular staff, they, (3 of them) were having trouble with my, "How are you?" and finally I wrote it down. They didn't chastise me, they chastised themselves for not understanding what I said and apologized. I have travelled widely and I still think the Vietnamese are the nicest people in the world.

Hi I Do Believe,

The misunderstanding may come from these three things: First, it is the intonation. Vietnamese has 6 tones and if stress is misplace, misunderstanding may occur. I did a little research and found that English has the same tones. But the difference is that the tones are marked clearly on each word whereas English does not. So, to overcome this difficulty, you need to memorize, just like we learn English stress, where the tones fall on each word (which it will be easier for me to explain more in detail with examples). Second, liaisons. Vietnamese do not link words together as English people do. So, be ware of word boundaries. Last but no least, pronunciation. Just like English, mispronouncing vowel variants may lead to misunderstanding or to no where.
Besides, dialect is a big trouble. Just like the difference between British English and American English. Even Vietnamese find it difficult to understand each other if speakers come from different regions of the country.
I would love to help foreigner speak Vietnamese in an understanding way. You can ask me questions regarding your Vietnamese speaking difficulties.
Good luck with your Vietnamese use.
Mick

@Mick bui

Thanks for your input but I was taught all of your suggestions when I attended the University of Social Sciences and Humanities on Dinh Tien Hoang St.for four months eight years ago. Your suggestions are correct but I know what my problem is; I must discipline myself to read and write some Vietnamese every day. I understand the tones but have not memorized enough words with the appropriate tones. Context gets me through a lot. I decided to try and find a beautiful woman to tutor me seven years ago and am still looking for her. As an over the hill procrastinator my progress will be measured in millimeters rather than inches.

I do believe wrote:

@Mick bui
I decided to try and find a beautiful woman to tutor me seven years ago and am still looking for her.

Why is that sir?
Can you still listen to a beautiful woman when she see in your eyes so deeply ?

I wish the movers and shakers would give us a thumbs down button so we can disagree with some comments.

Some of the suggestions on this topic are ludicrous.  My favourite negative is those who insist a Vietnamese word must be pronounced exact. When this suggestion is made by a Vietnamese person I realize that Vietnamese person is one of those Vietnamese who doesn't understand Vietnamese spoken by a foreigner. For example Southern dialects will omit using the ngã tone and replace it with the hỏi tone. So how exactly would the one thousand or more words with these tones be pronounced?

While eating at a restaurant serving Hanoi style food the owner could not understand vegetable when pronounced "rau" but understood the word pronounced "zau". Beyond belief in Saigon! Yes tones are important but only part of the puzzle.

In any case I enjoy the continual battle to speak and learn about the Vietnamese language. Besides occasional frustration it is fascinating.

@ ngattt

A beautiful woman would keep me focused and I would do whatever she says. I wouldn't look into her eyes because I would be lost..............

I do believe wrote:

@ ngattt

A beautiful woman would keep me focused and I would do whatever she says. I wouldn't look into her eyes because I would be lost..............

Hahaha, because when I teach Vietnamese for foreigners, one to one, I know that I don't want to look into their eyes . Its always very dangerous .

Back to the topic, last week when I teach Vietnamese for a foreigner, he said Vietnamese to another foreigner, then "which language are you saying" ? Even I hear it very clearly, he spoke quite well. Maybe just because we didn't focus on what people were saying, so its hard to understand.

@ ngattt

Most foreign men are fascinated with Beautiful Vietnamese Woman. You are right be careful when you teach one on one because men will always be men and Beautiful Vietnamese Woman are are are.........

Back to the language topic - I have difficulty understanding a foreigner speaking Vietnamese because their pronunciation is so bad (compared to mine). But------I can usually figure it out. HELLO - PEOPLE - figure it out!

If you are speaking Vietnamese with a foreign accent, you still sound lovely. You know that, don't you?
Isn't having a partner speaking the target language that lovely too?

So speak it with your heart, and let the other heart decipher your words. Hope you can find her soon!

Simple:
1,Their brain still not yet processed your Vietnamese ( which they expect you to speak English), so they think to themselves: what are those english words ?
2. They are shy when they see some white man speak vietnamese with them ( normally cashiers are all girls), so they get stiff ( psychological problem)
3. Or due to the vietnamese language: HCMC is a melting pot of people from all over vietnam with all kinds of accent, and even vietnamese cant understand a vietnamese from different area speak ( especially countryside of North, or Central- the language sucks

" 2. They are shy when they see some white man speak vietnamese with them ( normally cashiers are all girls), so they get stiff ( psychological problem)"
 
Yes, that can be a problem with " white " men as well, when they see a beautiful girl.

bluenz wrote:

Yes, that can be a problem with " white " men as well, when they see a beautiful girl.

Hahaha, I don't think "white" men are shy when they see a beautiful girl. They may think how to seduce her .

BTW, back to the topic, I think Vietnamese doesn't have rules same same English, and have so many tones as well. So its hard for Vietnamese to guess what you are saying. I am a person who always try to listen, my Vietnamese are quite good, but sometimes, I still can't guess what foreigners are saying when I teach them Vietnamese.

ngattt wrote:

bluenz wrote:

Yes, that can be a problem with " white " men as well, when they see a beautiful girl.

Hahaha, I don't think "white" men are shy when they see a beautiful girl. They may think how to seduce her .

BTW, back to the topic, I think Vietnamese doesn't have rules same same English, and have so many tones as well. So its hard for Vietnamese to guess what you are saying. I am a person who always try to listen, my Vietnamese are quite good, but sometimes, I still can't guess what foreigners are saying when I teach them Vietnamese.

I was actually meaning more of a physical problem, than psychological, but you probably knew that.
It must also be very confusing for VNs because we use the same word for different meanings in English so much, often without altering the tone/accent, where in Viet, you have a Viet word before/after that word. ( which many foreigners forget, and if the tone isn't " exact ", it leaves VN's confused, i.e, muỗi, can be mosquito, (  con muỗi ), or mười by itself, ( 10, and the name of a lot of VNs I know ), muối tiêu, ( grizzle, same as many foreigners have here, not to be confused with " grizzle " as we also do, or " gristle " as in most VN meat ).

dont give up. keep on speaking vietnamese. it will be easy for your to communicate with someone who dont know how to speak English

Maybe your stress doesnt rigt. Or when you talking you should use " casual speaking" not use " writing " theories. Ex, when you meet someone( not so close) , you just say " chào( bạn, anh,chị, cô, chú....)."dont say " xin chào, em( cô, dì, chú, bác..) có khoẻ không". Or when you meet up someone so close to you , long time no see and you wanna say " khoẻ không" , you should say " chào em( anh, chị, cô , bác...) lâu ngày có khoẻ không? Its mean " hello, are you good? ( hello, ảe you fine?).. Vietnamese dont say " khoẻ không" with the one not so close or meet up everyday.  If you say " em co khoe khong" with the people not close to you they will think you are practing Vietnamese or you are try to joking for a bit fun. Not so serious. So i think they will abit suprised and they never fix your mistake becos they think" he is a foreinger speakig english.so they dont care you are speaking correct or not. So you dont know how to fix it.

ahhh my favourite subject how about this (and the first one applies to all women not just Vietnamese women):

Her: Dont talk to me.
Me: OK
Her (an hour later): Why are you ignoring me?

Last year I was watching cricket via live streaming magic from the Oval in UK and she asked: Whats that?
I said: Cricket.

She said: Whats that?
I said: Shhh I'm watching, its a kind of sport.
She: What kind of sport, football?
Me: No, it's cricket.
She: Explain?
Me: Sigh, OK you asked, it's like this:

You have two sides, one out in the field and one in.
Each man that's in the side that's in goes out, and when he's out he comes in and the next man goes in until he's out. When they are all out, the side that's out comes in and the side thats been in goes out and tries to get those coming in, out.
Sometimes you get men still in and not out.

When a man goes out to go in, the men who are out try to get him out, and when he is out he goes in and the next man in goes out and goes in.
There are two men called umpires who stay all out all the time and they decide when the men who are in are out. When both sides have been in and all the men have been out, and both sides have been out twice after all the men have been in, including those who are not out, that is the end of the game!

See?

Her: Điên cái đầu

After watching Jurassic Park .....
Her: You know those big animals?
Me: What Tyrannosaurus?
Her: Yeah.
Me: Well what about them?
Her: Do they really have them in America?
Me: Yeah but only in Hollywood.
Her: Wow! They must keep them in cages then?

And on another occasion.....
Me: Honey oi, I am leaving for Tuvalu next Friday.
Her: Oh is that a place?
Me: Yeah, it's in the Pacific ocean.
Her: Oh, where is that?

Bless her. Two masters degrees and and an MBA and they allow her to run companies.

Matt,
Did you explain to her why after nearly a week of Test cricket , it can often end in a draw.   😁

Let us know how that goes.

Then you can explain what a duck is in cricket.  When your out for a duck , that doesn't mean you've gone to KFC.

Yogi007 wrote:

Matt,
Did you explain to her why after nearly a week of Test cricket , it can often end in a draw.   😁

Let us know how that goes.

Then you can explain what a duck is in cricket.  When your out for a duck , that doesn't mean you've gone to KFC.

Ah well, just for our Vietnamese friends....

Y'see in most parts of the world a draw is the same as a tie; that is to say that the game ended with the results being equal. However in Cricket there is a difference between the two:
Cricket distinguishes between a tie and a draw, which are two possible results of a game:

Tie: A tie is the equal result when each team has scored the same total number of runs after their allotted innings, all innings being completed. This is very rare in Test cricket and has happened only twice in its long history, but they are slightly more commonplace in first-class and limited-overs matches.

Draw: A draw is the inconclusive result that occurs when the allotted playing time for the game expires without the teams having completed their innings. This is relatively common, occurring in 20-30% of Test matches with a perhaps higher percentage of first-class matches as they are scheduled for four days instead of five. Limited-overs matches cannot be drawn, although they can end with a no result if abandoned because of weather or other factors.

As for the duck (or Vit, in Vietnamese):
The name is believed to come from the shape of the number "0" being similar to that of a duck's egg. Hence a batsman scoring zero runs is termed as "DUCK".
If a batsman get out on the first ball faced by him it's known as "Golden Duck".
If the batsman get out on the first ball of the innings then it is known as "Diamond Duck"
If the batsman get out for Zero in both the innings of the test match it is termed as "Pair".

I  might introduce her to fielding positions such as "silly mid on" later.

But when I mentioned it to her just now she said she didn't want to discuss the "silly game" any more. So next season I should be left alone to watch in peace.

Old Saigon Hand wrote:

LOL couldn't agree more dasiavu. Since expats are guests in someone else country the onus is on them to speak well enough to be understood.

Hmmmmmm well I am learning Vietnamese bit by bit and my (Vietnamese) wife who is from Da Lat, but who has lived in Saigon for more than ten years, tells me that when I speak the little Vietnamese that I know, my pronunciation is virtually perfect. She gets frustrated with people when they don't understand what I say and asks them "if you can understand me, why cant you understand him?" but usually doesn't get a satisfactory response.

Another person on here has complained about foreigners arrogance so I would ask, why is trying to learn Vietnamese in the face of an unwillingness to understand, an indication of arrogance. And I would go as far as to say that if a foreigner tries to speak Vietnamese, like many people here tell us to do, surely it works both ways and the Vietnamese should out of courtesy at least just try to understand (many do) instead staring at us with a blank face in disbelief.

One other point I can contribute is that taxi drivers in Vietnam can be tricky at times, however I have never had a taxi driver stare at me with a blank face when I give them directions in Vietnamese. They might ask me to repeat something occasionally but never the blank face treatment..

Haha it is funny when reading these problems. Vietnamese words have different meaning if you make your voice up or down. For example, with the word "Má", its mean "mother", you have to raise your voice up. If not, it become "Ma", its mean "ghost". If you make your voice down, it become "Mạ", its mean "young rice tree".
Other instance, "xin chào" means "hello". if you raise your voice, it become "xin cháo", its mean "ask for rice soup".
I hope they works for you.
it is so funny to know Vietnamese people don't understand Vietnamese.

I think some foreigners meant: Vietnamese didn't try to understand Vietnamese from foreigners, they didn't pay attention, and guess what foreigners were trying to say. Because we can understand something in context, and some Vietnamese didn't try to put it in context.

ngattt wrote:

I think some foreigners meant: Vietnamese didn't try to understand Vietnamese from foreigners, they didn't pay attention, and guess what foreigners were trying to say. Because we can understand something in context, and some Vietnamese didn't try to put it in context.

I think some foreigner's comments here mean to say: Vietnamese don't try to understand Vietnamese spoken by a foreigner, they don't pay attention, and don't try to figure out what a foreigner is trying to say.  We Vietnamese can understand somethings in context but some Vietnamese don't even try to put the foreigners speech in context.

But ngatt that's not what really bothers us, it's the blank eye look or the hand signal that is infuriating. To a foreigner it is simple common sense to listen to what a person is saying to you and digest if it's Vietnamese or not. Tonight I was lost in the far reaches of District 7 and asked different people where is district one - in Vietnamese  (Quận 1 ở đâu?). Most people asked me to repeat it and then instructed me where to go. One woman just looked at me strangely and kept on walking, a young man the same. This tells me, either my Vietnamese is improving or the Vietnamese are improving; up from fifty/fifty.

You know, I am Vietnamese, but sometimes I can not recognize what is spoken by a person with central accent or northern accent. I also ask them repeat what they are saying. I need some seconds to figure out what they want to say.  I think it happens with Vietnamese people who speak Vietnamese.
Foreigners have different accents, so it needs time to familiar with that. Not much chance to communicate with foreigners, how can they understand at the first time hearing different accent.

Kate3687 wrote:

You know, I am Vietnamese, but sometimes I can not recognize what is spoken by a person with central accent or northern accent. I also ask them repeat what they are saying. I need some seconds to figure out what they want to say.  I think it happens with Vietnamese people who speak Vietnamese.
Foreigners have different accents, so it needs time to familiar with that. Not much chance to communicate with foreigners, how can they understand at the first time hearing different accent.

I live Central, and that's why I've stopped wasting my time trying to learn Viet, only every 2nd person can understand me,( if I'm lucky ) .
I now learn on a need to know basis, ( if I need to know something in Viet, that I don't have a sample/photo/drawing or can't act out, I will learn the words ).

bluenz wrote:

Kate3687 wrote:

You know, I am Vietnamese, but sometimes I can not recognize what is spoken by a person with central accent or northern accent. I also ask them repeat what they are saying. I need some seconds to figure out what they want to say.  I think it happens with Vietnamese people who speak Vietnamese.
Foreigners have different accents, so it needs time to familiar with that. Not much chance to communicate with foreigners, how can they understand at the first time hearing different accent.

I live Central, and that's why I've stopped wasting my time trying to learn Viet, only every 2nd person can understand me,( if I'm lucky ) .
I now learn on a need to know basis, ( if I need to know something in Viet, that I don't have a sample/photo/drawing or can't act out, I will learn the words ).

I think foreigner should learn Vietnamese from Hanoi and communicate with Hanoi only because Vietnamese from Hanoi is correct in spelling and pronunciation. Vietnamese from southern is right in writing, but wrong in pronunciation (speaking). That is my language, don't ask why it is like that. therefore, It is very difficult for foreigners to learn Vietnamese from southern because what you study in books is different from what you meet or hear from Vietnamese native speakers. For example, in writing "đi về = go home", in speaking you will hear "đi dìa or đi dề".
in writing "Giận = mad at someone", you will hear "dận". They change "V and GI" to "D". and other words like that. If you want to understand you should learn with a southern person, not with a teacher.

Kate3687 wrote:

bluenz wrote:

Kate3687 wrote:

You know, I am Vietnamese, but sometimes I can not recognize what is spoken by a person with central accent or northern accent. I also ask them repeat what they are saying. I need some seconds to figure out what they want to say.  I think it happens with Vietnamese people who speak Vietnamese.
Foreigners have different accents, so it needs time to familiar with that. Not much chance to communicate with foreigners, how can they understand at the first time hearing different accent.

I live Central, and that's why I've stopped wasting my time trying to learn Viet, only every 2nd person can understand me,( if I'm lucky ) .
I now learn on a need to know basis, ( if I need to know something in Viet, that I don't have a sample/photo/drawing or can't act out, I will learn the words ).

I think foreigner should learn Vietnamese from Hanoi and communicate with Hanoi only because Vietnamese from Hanoi is correct in spelling and pronunciation. Vietnamese from southern is right in writing, but wrong in pronunciation (speaking). That is my language, don't ask why it is like that. therefore, It is very difficult for foreigners to learn Vietnamese from southern because what you study in books is different from what you meet or hear from Vietnamese native speakers. For example, in writing "đi về = go home", in speaking you will hear "đi dìa or đi dề".
in writing "Giận = mad at someone", you will hear "dận". They change "V and GI" to "D". and other words like that. If you want to understand you should learn with a southern person, not with a teacher.

I was told that as well, ( but I'd expect to hear that from a Northerner ), I think Northerners sound like they have a German accent, when their English pronounciation isn't very good.
I had to laugh one day when this French bloke was at my wife's house, ( he is fluent in Viet,  but still can't talk to a VN by phone, or understand some of his farmer neighbours ), he was talking to my Canadian friends about speaking Viet, he said don't listen to my wife, she doesn't speak Viet properly, he was taught Viet in Hanoi, yet when my wife speaks English, she also has what sounds like a German accent??????  ( Zis and Zat, Zey, Zermany, etc ).

You, expats couldn't be as fluent as an American pastor in Vietnamese language (1965-during the height of VN war, Danang) when I was there as a kid. He could lecture for hours in Vietnamese speech for...Vietnamese audiences w/o any issue). Do not give up when you try a hard Foreign language like...Vietnamese. Even my own kids who were born and raised in Canada having hard time to speak Vietnamese within my guidance. Most of my Western friends who tried to speak Vietnamese I hardly understand. The main problem is their own pronunciation and tone in which I have to correct it. Always admit your fault and try to learn is the only way for a guarantee of improvement. Hopefully it helps...

I 've just come back from Hoi An - Da Nang.  It 's seem silly but 40% conversations between me and locals went to nothing.  I had to ask them please to speak slowly and clearly,  listened carefully as I were in my language class.  And ordering food made by hand (showed them on menu ) cause they always thought about another food =]] ,  and I couldn't know why 2 women  quarreling on an old brigde in Hoi An ( so currious he.. he..) oh my God,  my country has 3 part North South and Middle but if go from North to South we have many kinds of pronuonciation and phonic.  But anyway Vietnamese 's so interesting,  let's try it guys.